57 X 390 (6 pounder Davis gun rounds)

For me these are the holy grail of 6 pounder rounds.

Attached are photographs of the 2 different 6 pounder Davis gun cases that I know of.

The first one which I am speculating may be the latter of the two cases is shown as the case on its own.
Length 390mm
Rim diameter 69.34mm
Diameter of the hole in the base 57.09mm
The primer is a number 5 with a diameter of 20.22mm
The thickness of the rim is 6.37mm
The thickness of the case wall at the mouth is 1.85mm (yes, its thick)

The stamping on this case (its stamped on the side as seen in the photo) is as follows:
G.O.Co
6-PDR
MK II Mou
LOT 9
6-16

The second one (shown with the projectile) which I am speculating as being possibly an earlier version due to the lack of stamping on the side and an unusual primer is as follows:
Length 390mm
Rim diameter 69.51mm
Diameter of the hole in the base 57.02mm
The primer has a diameter of 17.43mm
The thickness of the rim is 4.00mm

Sorry guys, stick with me on this, I'm sure someone out there is interested in all these measurements (these rounds aren't even listed on some of the cartridge lists out there)..........

The projectile has the following measurements:-

Length from the base of the driving band to the tip is 180mm (can't measure the length of the whole projectile because I don't want to crack the case by trying to pull it out)
Depth of driving band is 10.34mm

The stampings on the projectile are as follows:
Rudge Whitworth Ltd.
(crowsfoot)
S
INCDY AZ
I
Davis Gun
B
/17
S

The gun itself was the invention of an American Commander Davies. They were made in 2,6 and 12 pounder versions and consisted of 2 barrels, one pointing forwards and one pointing backwards, both coming out of one chamber. The cartridge carried a propelling charge between the projectile and an equal weight countershot. The primer was set into the side fo the case centrally between the two separate half charges of propellant. To line the primer with the striker lugs were fitted to the outside of the cartridge case just above the extraction rim (this can be seen clearly in the photographs). The counter shot was a smooth cylinder of steel fitted at the inner end with a thin copper sealing disc which expanded on firing to prevent gas escape.
The forward barrel was chambered and rifled in the normal manner (24 grooves).
The guns were designed as aircraft guns. They were declared obsolete in April 1919.
High explosive, incendiary and case shot were all developed.

The photos show:
Davis gun case and complete round next to a 6 pounder 7cwt apds (for scale)
The bases of the cases
Primer on the early case
Inside of the case showing the primer from the inside
Stamping on the projectile (Rudge Whitworth came out clearly, the rest of the stamping is very very faint so didn't come out well so no photo of that).

If anyone has any photos of rounds in their collection I'd be interested in seeing them (or indeed if they have any spare they wish to part with!!).

Dave.

A few more photos of the case (the one I think is the more recent one).
Dave.

Go To; Big Ordnance .com

and you will see one. Andrew Duiguid in the U.S. his web site. He isn't quick to answer emails ~

Thanks Gordon, now that has added to it all, a finned version!!?
Very nice!
Dave.

always - Glad to Help ~

Or did I make it Worse ! :tinysmile_cry_t2:

6 Pdr Davis projectile and 2 Pdr Davis case

I have attached photos of my 6 Pdr Davis Projo. It appears that it is fired electrically! The rotating band has insulators around it, and an insulated copper wire travels from the rotating band inside the projectile through an insulated hole in the brass plug that screws into the base of the projectile.

The frayed insulation can be seen in the one photo of the base with the plug out.

I have never seen a proper 2 Pdr projo to know if the one in the photo is real or not.

John

question

This question is probably completely ignorant, but what would be the use of a gun firing out both ends? Dano

This was so that the recoil of the shell being fired would be counteracted by the metal weight being expelled from the other end of the gun.

HAZORD said:

I have attached photos of my 6 Pdr Davis Projo. It appears that it is fired electrically! The rotating band has insulators around it, and an insulated copper wire travels from the rotating band inside the projectile through an insulated hole in the brass plug that screws into the base of the projectile.

The frayed insulation can be seen in the one photo of the base with the plug out.

I have never seen a proper 2 Pdr projo to know if the one in the photo is real or not.

John

Click to expand...

John, they're great, very nice.
A pal of mine has 3 (yes three!!!!) correct 2 pounder Davis gun projectiles. They are very easy to mistake for common pointed 2 pounder projectiles but the base of them have vents in them (he won't part with any of them because they are all slightly different!).
Dave.

Do you think he might let you shoot a photo or two of the projos?

Yes, I'll take a few photos next time I'm at his place, probably in about a month.

Dave.

I found a few patents pertaining to this subject ~

Bear with me, will take a few postings. I have never seen so many patents by one individual ! There are many more under his name on different aspects of munitions and torpedoes etc. I have to pull the images from the pdf files and convert to jpgs. will post next week on high speed.

There's a 6 pdr Davis round in the ammo collection at Shrivenham, IIRC with original paint on the projectile. I put a photo in the ECRA Bulletin a couple of years back (510-25).

Hoping these load

Davis Patent, there are more. He even patented golf balls --

search Google Patent search with ; Cleland Davis

many of his patents and a few others by others on things related that didn't make it ! .

Thanks for looking it up and posting the info!

Gspragge, according to the diagram you posted, these were still in service in 1923, I didn't realise they were in use that late.

6 Pounder Davis gun shells

I noticed this thread a short time ago , but its taken me this time to get my act together and get some photographs taken of my Davis gun shells and also learn how to get pictures up as well! (Turns out its easy!).
The main problem with the images was in getting the stamped information on the shells to stand out clearly - this was solved using the time honoured method of applying talcum powder to the shell and then wiping off to leave it in the stampings.I think the end result shows well the information on the shell itself. The second image shows the shell with the base removed and the multi hole left hand threaded closing disc removed, along with the central distance piece tube and it's wooden cap. These and the interior of the shell are painted with a brown coloured varnish, some of which is flaking off with age. Both of the shells when I got them were painted with a very thick (Obviously wrong!!) battleship grey paint which was removed soon after purchase - this revealed very small traces of yellow paint on one shell and olive drab on the other.
Both the shells were fitted loosely to two six pounder naval cartridge cases and I suspect they were fireside ornaments for a good part of their life!

Enjoy.

WOW, really nice projectiles, you're very lucky to have one that unscrews complete with all the internals as well. I've sent you a PM about this.
Thanks for showing them.
Dave.

very nice bockcar

regards lee

2 Pounder Davis case primer

Hazord, please could you post some close-up photos of the primer on your 2 Pounder Davis case.

Another member has a case that was de trench-arted from a lamp. They would like me to make a replica primer for it.

Also, please could you have a look what it looks like inside the case.