British Ordnance Collectors Network
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
18Pr Mk II case
- Thread starter doctor
- Start date
The primer was made by EWBCo - E W Bliss & Co in the United States, and there is a 5/16 date at 6-7 o'clock which is likely the manufacturing date. Significant numbers of US-made fuzes and primers were found to be defective and required rectification or conversion in the UK before finally being filled, and this primer seems to be one of them.
The repair/conversion was carried out by RAL - RA Lister & Co. Ltd; the contract details, attached above, dated 19/7/16 and 5/4/17 show repair and conversion contracts. The No.1 II is over stamped No.1 IIC (converted) and there is a corresponding repair/conversion date of 8/17 at 6 o'clock. Finally the primer was filled at National Filling Factory No.5 (Gloucester) in 11/17, the date stamped over the RAL mark.
As for the two extra key slots, ToA 1915 states for repair of No.1 MkII primers, "fresh key slots will also be prepared if necessary".
The repair/conversion was carried out by RAL - RA Lister & Co. Ltd; the contract details, attached above, dated 19/7/16 and 5/4/17 show repair and conversion contracts. The No.1 II is over stamped No.1 IIC (converted) and there is a corresponding repair/conversion date of 8/17 at 6 o'clock. Finally the primer was filled at National Filling Factory No.5 (Gloucester) in 11/17, the date stamped over the RAL mark.
As for the two extra key slots, ToA 1915 states for repair of No.1 MkII primers, "fresh key slots will also be prepared if necessary".
Tom,
Although it was convention for the subcontractor's monogram or trademark to follow the contractors, I would be surprised if Bliss did make the primer. Bliss, along with American Locomotive Company (ALCO) and Bethlehem Steel Company (BSC) subcontracted out a great deal of work. The United States Cartridge Company (US) on the other hand are known to have been subcontractors to both ALCO and BSC
United States Cartridge Co, acquired?by Winchester, acquired by Olin.
TimG
Although it was convention for the subcontractor's monogram or trademark to follow the contractors, I would be surprised if Bliss did make the primer. Bliss, along with American Locomotive Company (ALCO) and Bethlehem Steel Company (BSC) subcontracted out a great deal of work. The United States Cartridge Company (US) on the other hand are known to have been subcontractors to both ALCO and BSC
United States Cartridge Co, acquired?by Winchester, acquired by Olin.
TimG
Last edited:
Many thanks to Snufkin. I don't knew before that on a primer N°I/IIC ( in fact a N°I/III), the C was for converted.
Primers with foor tool slots are very rare. All I have (except one) are II converted IIC by RAL on 18 Pr Mk II cases.
I try to separate the different markings but I don't guarantee my explanations.
1) (N°I/II no more visible) HS 5/16; KN 9/16; N°I/IIC RAL 6/17; F5 9/18.
2) N°I/IIA B 2/16; N°I/IIC RAL 6/17; F5 11/17.
3) N°I/II us EWBCO LOT 609 4/15; N°I/IIC RAL 9/17; F2 /6/18 and B?
4) N°I/II polar bear 16 Ccrossed 104 broad arrow in a C; N°I/IIC RAL 6/17; F5 10/17.
5) On a 4.5 INCH MkI. N°I/II R broad arrow L (barred out) 5/15 (barred out); VSM A 7/16.
So primers with four tool slots were not all made by RAL.
Dandebur.
Primers with foor tool slots are very rare. All I have (except one) are II converted IIC by RAL on 18 Pr Mk II cases.
I try to separate the different markings but I don't guarantee my explanations.
1) (N°I/II no more visible) HS 5/16; KN 9/16; N°I/IIC RAL 6/17; F5 9/18.
2) N°I/IIA B 2/16; N°I/IIC RAL 6/17; F5 11/17.
3) N°I/II us EWBCO LOT 609 4/15; N°I/IIC RAL 9/17; F2 /6/18 and B?
4) N°I/II polar bear 16 Ccrossed 104 broad arrow in a C; N°I/IIC RAL 6/17; F5 10/17.
5) On a 4.5 INCH MkI. N°I/II R broad arrow L (barred out) 5/15 (barred out); VSM A 7/16.
So primers with four tool slots were not all made by RAL.
Dandebur.