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  1. #1
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    Identification of an Italian 90/53 shell

    I know there have been more than one threads about this particular cartridge, but I couldn't find the info I was looking for in there, so here is another go..

    I recently aquired this cartridge and I'm happy as a clam with it, and I managed to figure out a few things but I still have some questions about other matters, and i was hoping you guys could help me.

    Let's start with the fuse, the markings on the fuse say M.T MOD. 41 on one side and there's a big 'X' stamped in the material on the other side. Just above the 'X' is some kind of (proof?)marking. Does anyone know what the 'X'stands for?

    The markings 'M.T MOD.41' tells me the fuse should be a time fuse, and after I managed to remove the cover of the fuze, and comparing it with the drawings in TM9-1985-6, my conclusion is that the MOD. 41 fuse is probably a further developement of the M36 mechanical time fuse. Which I'm very happy with, because that means that the projectile on my cartridge was a a true AA round!

    Then the projectile, I've found some info about the markings of Italian He rounds, but mine has a deviation... My sources (http://michaelhiske.de/Allierte/UK/H...t07/07_001.htm) say that HE shells all have a light blue/grey-ish colour from the driving band up to the 'shoulder'. Mine has that too, so far, so good.
    But the 'head', from the fuse down to the 'shoulder' should be red, and my projectile is white in that area. As I can't really find any further pictures of this cartridge other than those on this forum I would like to know why my projectile has a white upper half, so any help you guys can give me would be appreciated!

    The green band directly above the driving band indicates that the filling of this shell consisted of TNT or Amatol, but halfway between the driving band and the shoulder there's a blue band, and I can't find the meaning of that band anywhere.
    Then there is also a marking that says 'INERT' between the green and blue bands, but that's probably added in the past, when this shell was emptied.

    Then the last curiousity, which is a part of the headstamps...
    @ 12 'o clock we see the date of manufacture: Jan 1941, and @ 9 '0 clock we can see the casing is made by Ansaldo.
    But @ 2 'o clock -ish there is a stamp that says 'AEP 1951', does anyone know what that stamp is from?

    Thanks in advance for your help.

    All the best,


    Danny
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  2. The Following User Says Thank You to DannyH88 For This Useful Post:

    MINENAZ16 (11th February 2020)

  3. #2
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    Hello,
    We need help from member "Fert".
    I remember he showed an Italian 90mm made during ww2 with steel bands like your shell.
    Regards

    MT 41 sez.jpg90 Italy.jpg
    Any Live or Dug ordnance shown by me has been disposed of by EOD personnel .

  4. The Following User Says Thank You to MINENAZ16 For This Useful Post:

    DannyH88 (12th February 2020)

  5. #3
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    Hi Minen,

    I've seen his pictures, and hopefully Fert can give some clarity.
    Thanks for the cut-away drawing of the MOD. 41 fuse, I didn't get any further than the M36.

    All the best,

    Danny

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    Ok, so I did some further digging, and I think I found out what kind of round it is. I'm still not 100% sure, but it's the only thing I can think of.
    So, I think this is a drill round.
    I got to this conclusion because:
    -The different color between the fuse and the shoulder, it doesn't look like this color was applied recently, and if it had been a 'real' (by lack of a better word) HE shell that part should be painted red. Since the term 'Inert' is written on the projectile aswell I can only conclude it has to be a drill cartridge.

    The next thing is about the weight. Compared with an empty 8,8cm Flak18 cartridge the 90mm round weights a full 7kg's more!
    The weight is consistent with what I found in TM9-1985-6, though I suspect that the indicated weight is of a loaded round with propellant and filler. When I shake the cartridge I can hear what seems like sand running in the casing. I'm going to see if I can remove the primer to verify.

    I'll keep you guys posted!


    Danny

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    The 1951 head stamp is due to post war re-use.
    Ignorance is bliss.

  8. #6
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    good morning I am a new member of BOCN I confirm that it is an anti-aircraft 90/53. the green color indicates ordinary steel projecting while the blue band indicates use. in this case it indicates that the ammunition has an anti-aircraft use. the fuze is a mechanical time mod 36.

  9. The Following User Says Thank You to baronerosso84 For This Useful Post:

    TimG (23rd April 2020)

 

 

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