Common and Common lyddite

[FZG76]

Good morning all.


A quick question for British artillery specialists.

How to recognize a common shell loaded with black powder and an explosive common lyddite shell.

I know that the Common Lyddite adapter is bronze with large engraved numbers.

I believe that the Common black powder also has a bronze adapter ....

Anyone have an answer and pictures of Common Black Powder ??
thanks in advance

 

[2pounder]

colour scheme would be obvious but if its missing , is this a gerneral question or re a specific calibre?

 

[FZG76]

Thank you for your attention.


This is a general question. No particular caliber ...

 

[glevum]

can you Xray them?

 

[FZG76]

I can't x-ray them.
I don't have the projectiles!

This is a general question in order to know if the black powder load has an adapter like the Common Lyddite ...

 

[doctor]

Hi
For example 4,5 in Shell charged with Lyddite had also steel adapter so bronze adapter commonly encountered is not a generality.
An other example, 60 Pr can be found with bronze adapter N°2 1 or N°108 fuze, these shells were filling with Black Powder in bag so imposible without paint or marks to know the filling

 

[AE501]

The first cylindro-conoidal shells did not appear until the development of propellants based on nitrocellulose. Until that time only gunpowder was available which under confinement exploded violently and gave rise to short cannon with short ranges.
Picric Acid had been produced early in the 19th century, but was used as a dye (Aniline used in liquid rocket propellants was also developed as a dye). Its use as a high explosive became possible with the development of the Mercury Fulminate detonator.
Not until 1885 were Picric Acid (Lyddite) shell experiments carried out leading to their production in 1895, also adopted by the Germans in 1887 who switched to TNT in 1904.

All long exploding shell from about 1870 were filled with gunpowder (composition 'P') until that time. Both types were still in Treatises on Ammunition as late as 1915. The early nose fuzed composition 'P' shell had different longer adapters to those in later shell.
The two shell shown had the the same bronze Plug Fuzehole Special Mk2 and as they were now both common, the Lyddite filled shell must have been produced after 1895 and the composition 'P' shell must have been produced around the same time.
Pre WWI these plugs were made of bronze but I expect, as Doctor pointed out, mass production to fill the gap led to them being made of steel.

The early Lyddite shell (see drawing) had a yellow basic body colour and a red filling ring on the shoulders.
The common composition 'P' filled shell were black, had a red filling ring and a white ring denoting steel, round the shoulders.