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you MUST learn from your dad..........

agree bulleted rounds should never be there, no need to be. Cant help thinking basics, if some one handed me a closed gun and said it was empty then I'd check to make sure, its what real men do not actors and second basic is you do not point a gun at someone unless you want to kill them. Sad that some one died to remind the film industry guns are not things you 'play' with.
 
It can't be that difficult I think.... NO live ammo on a film set, and visualy check any weapon to be used in a scene just prior to the moment the camera starts roling.
 
I bet there is a cinematographic definition of "armourer" (movies are basically animated legal documents written by armies of lawyers) and that definition is different from our definition.
 
sksvlad said:
I bet there is a cinematographic definition of "armourer" (movies are basically animated legal documents written by armies of lawyers) and that definition is different from our definition.
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That may be true.

All the film armourers I have heard about in the UK have been ex military and applied military and UK Health and Safety Rules vigorously. My local gunsmith worked with a few of them and I heard a few tales from him. Ownership of multiple live weapons is strictly controlled in the UK and losing your license would mean losing your income.
 
The actor is known to be anti gun and anti shooting although acting with them is how he makes his money. Think the armourer is getting stick she may not fully deserve. Still has not been disclosed if she put the guns out or loaded them. Reports are it is a low budget film and had lots of safety issues before the shooting. Did someone cut a corner to save money? only a full enquiry will show. To me live ammo is that with a primer and charge, and either a bullet or crimped to be a blank, is my definition wrong? ie a blank is technically a live round. Remember the last on set killing when a bullet had lodged in the gun barrel and was propelled out when a blank was fired, if that is true then again negligence in weapon checking, look down the barrel is a good habit before loading unless absolutely shure a bullet came out last shot.
 
In some states, New York for instance, prop guns must have a barrel block to prevent bullets going down the barrel.

The Armorer's father, Thell Reed, is one of the most famous quick draw people around, and he has been the Armorer on movies in the past. He was famous when I was a kid.

As Sksvlad has said, she should have learned gun safety from her Father.
 
As with all industrial accidents, there have to be multiple failures for this to happen. Live ammunition on the set is failure number one. Also, Baldwin obviously failed to inspect the weapon that was handed to him. He can cry all he wants about it being someone else's fault, but as a long time competition pistol shooter, I will always believe it was ultimately his responsibility to check the weapon.

It is interesting that most of the crew was escorted off the set that day before the accident. How did live ammunition get onto the set? I am willing to wager a murder charge will be coming for someone soon due to an act of sabotage.
 
M8owner said:
As with all industrial accidents, there have to be multiple failures for this to happen.
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Exactly, same as we learn with nat. geographic on aircraft accidents; it's hardly ever one big mistake, but nearly allways a series of small mistakes combined with human error, misunderstanding, lack of training or complatency.
This mix is usualy fatal.
 
The other shoe dropped today in the news: the cast were shooting the gun recreationally that morning. Live ammunition was allowed on the set - a gross violation of the safety rules. It seems there was a lax attitude toward safety on the set - the reason why the crew walked out. As one of the producers, allowing that to happen was also Alec Baldwin's fault.

It appears my sabotage/murder prediction was wrong. I failed to anticipate how stupid some people can be (that is a fib - nothing surprises me).

One thing is for certain, that armorer will never get another movie job - ever.
 
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It just keeps getting worse. In the days before the accident, it now comes out there were three live rounds accidentally discharged on the set, and they did nothing about this.
 
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On the shipyard where I work a "near miss" stops all work on a project completely untill it has been thouroughy investigated and appropriate action has been undertaken to prevent it from ever happening again.
How is it possible that three live rounds (three near misses) were discharged without stopping all works and thoroughly investigate. I think I know the awnser..... we've got tight a schedule to keep, and time is money for the investers.
Now the final result is one avoidable dead, prosecution and jail for the culpable, a big financial loss, and careers in ruins.
 
I see Baldwin is calling for more safety when guns are used on set, He should accept responsibility for not personally checking the gun was empty and stop blaming others.
 
now stupid wants the police on set checking guns, you're right can't fix stupid. as if the police haven't anything better to do. Its what the armourer should be doing and not letting guns out of their sight. I still have trouble believing she made basic mistakes when learnt from her father who must have instilled in his daughter safety in all its forms.
 
I have nothing against the police, but your average police officer is a rather poor choice for such an assignment.
 
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