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U.S. or French V.B. rifle grenade

Hi all. in photo 1 the far right grenade is a WW1 V.B. rifle grenade. It is stamped R.S. on the grenade body. Does anyone know if this would be a French V.B. or a United States V.B.??? I'm not sure of the differences (if any) between the U.S. and French versions. Also the photo on right is of a drawing of an m1917 practice German rifle grenade. I used to have but don't anymore. It has quite a bit more rounded bottom than its live counterpart. I am looking for one for my collection......Dano
 

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Hi Dano. Here's 3 VBs (2 x French & 1 x US). The US one was found in the Guadalcanal area and has been sand blasted and repainted. There are obvious differences between these French and US examples, but I don't know if these variations are the norm. Best Regards
 

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Hi Colin, I'll say there are some differences. Thank you kindly for posting that up. Mine appears to fall somewhere in the middle between the different ones you pictured? Nice V.B.'s by the way....Dano
 
Well, nothing is easy in this business. I've attached a photo of two VB's from my collection. The one on the right is US (looks a lot like the French ones posted earlier), the one on the left I am not sure of. Is the .22 rimfire cartridge still in the grenade? If so, is there a headstamp on it? All of the US ones I have seen have had headstamps on the cartridges. Don't know if they all did though, but the headstamp, if present, would be a good clue. The other photo is a close-up of my US one with the "H" headstamp from Winchester repeating Arms Co. Since I don't know for sure if my other one is French (although I suspect it is), I can't be of much other help. Although the French used the 8mm Lebel to launch the grenade and the US used the cal. .30 cartridge (7.62mm) there is no doubt insufficient difference there to measure the diameter of the central hole. My two are almost identical in diameter. Others with known specimen might be able to find different diameters.
 

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In Sgt Lynn's excellent book " The Grenade Recognition Manual vol 1 on US grenades, it states the differences between the US and French Vb's as:-
us ones are made from malable iron, french from cast iron. us ones are painted grey. bullet hole slightly smaller on us grens. the striker is a different shape and the centre tube is brass on french models and drawn steel on us models. the latter would be the easiest way of telling the difference.
heres a repainted one im sure is a us model. it has the steel centre tube and is marked GM "maybe General Motors?"
cheers paul.
 

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Internal view of U.s. VB1
Regards,
John
 
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I guess I need to read Darryll's book a little closer and I might learn something!!! I have attached the engineering drawing for the US VB. Not a good copy, but the original isn't much either.
 

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In Sgt Lynn's excellent book " The Grenade Recognition Manual vol 1 on US grenades, it states the differences between the US and French Vb's as:-
us ones are made from malable iron, french from cast iron. us ones are painted grey. bullet hole slightly smaller on us grens. the striker is a different shape and the centre tube is brass on french models and drawn steel on us models. the latter would be the easiest way of telling the difference.
heres a repainted one im sure is a us model. it has the steel centre tube and is marked GM "maybe General Motors?"
cheers paul.
Yes, GM would most likely be General Motors....Dano
 
Here's my (U.S.) GM marked VB with a (French) brass center tube. A conundrum.
 

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Here is my VB, with the steel central tube, couldn't get a photo that would show that so you will just have to take my word on it:tinysmile_twink_t:. The most obvious difference is the striker which is much more robust than those on french grenades and the striker point pressed into the striker is also different, on the french ones its a point whereas on the US ones its more like a bar running the distance of the striker (hope you understand what I am trying to say). Apparently according to another collector, the US ones have the Hex nut style filling plug and not the screw type as the french ones do. I have learned a lot since writing that first book, but my observations still stand on the VB (course I am always open to corrections). EODGUY if I am correct on the strikers, then I think both of yours are US.
 

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Thats a hard act to follow but here go,s,I have seen a number of the U.S. vb,s with the U.S. cast backwards on them.I can get a picture if someone needs to see one.
vinny :tinysmile_classes_t
 
Thats a hard act to follow but here go,s,I have seen a number of the U.S. vb,s with the U.S. cast backwards on them.I can get a picture if someone needs to see one.
vinny :tinysmile_classes_t
Yes Vinny, Would appreciate that and do appreciate everybody posting up their V.B.'s for viewing. I really like the un-rodded rifle grenades...Dano
 
I agree, both are no doubt US. I guess there were some US with unheadstamped rimfire cartridges! Both also have a hex nut plug. I also have a badly deteriorated small hex wrench that was used to remove the plug. Battlefield pick-up.
 
VB

Some images of the only one in my possession. I understood when I got it that it was a French one, but I'm open to other possibilities. The striker is made from stamped steel and the percussion cap is a centrefire, not a .22 rimfire.



Tom
 

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I've always been told that the ordnance stamp (flaming piss-pot) on the bottom was one ID feature for US models - can anyone confirm this?
 
Not on either one of mine! Interesting comment though because there were alot of WWI era ordnance items without that stamp so I wonder why it would be so on the VB?
 
There does not seem to be rhyme nor reason as to why some U.S. era ordnance has the flaming piss pot and some do not. I have seen V.B.'s with the symbol. You could have 2 indentical pieces of WW1 ordnance sitting side by side and one may have the symbol and one may not. I've always wondered about as to why? Dano
 
No flaming bomb on mine either.

Snufkin, I would say French for yours, based on the striker style.
 
Grenade Pics

Some pics of my VB. Any ideas of the markings on the body? Nationality?
 

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Wow, Great replies on this thread. I learned quite a bit about the V.B. grenade that I did not know. Awesome.....Dano
 
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