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.276" Pederson
- Thread starter smle2009
- Start date
TonyE
HONOURED MEMBER RIP
.276 Pederson
They have no relationship to the .276 P.13 round at all, it just happens that both are 7mm calibre which is .276 in Imperial measurement.
Pederson was working on his toggle lock self loading rifle at Springfield Armoury in the 1920s and he got very close to having it adopted by the US military. It was considered so likely that it would be adopted by the US that the rifle was trialled by the British with the intention of adopting it also. (Just another case of britain going for 7mm as the ideal calibre)
Vickers were given a license to manufacture the Pederson design and they made about 200 weapons in rifle and carbine configuration for British trials. Ammunition was made by both Kynoch and Greenwood & Batley in the UK. Trials went on until 1933.
In the event, there was opposition within the US Ordnance Department to adopting an intermediate 7mm cartridge (where have we heard that before?) and John Garand's self loading rifle in .30-06 was adopted in 1936.
For the full story on the US trials you need to read "Hatchers Notebook" by Julian Hatcher and for the ammunition history "US Military Small Arms Ammunition, Vol I" by Woodin, Hackley and Scranton.
Anyone interested in US military ammunition needs to have both Vol. I and 2 of the latter books. We have been waiting about twenty years for Volume 3, but I am assured by the authors not to worry, it will definitely be available some time in the next twenty years!
Pictures attached of British examples plus a US one for comparison.
Regards
TonyE
They have no relationship to the .276 P.13 round at all, it just happens that both are 7mm calibre which is .276 in Imperial measurement.
Pederson was working on his toggle lock self loading rifle at Springfield Armoury in the 1920s and he got very close to having it adopted by the US military. It was considered so likely that it would be adopted by the US that the rifle was trialled by the British with the intention of adopting it also. (Just another case of britain going for 7mm as the ideal calibre)
Vickers were given a license to manufacture the Pederson design and they made about 200 weapons in rifle and carbine configuration for British trials. Ammunition was made by both Kynoch and Greenwood & Batley in the UK. Trials went on until 1933.
In the event, there was opposition within the US Ordnance Department to adopting an intermediate 7mm cartridge (where have we heard that before?) and John Garand's self loading rifle in .30-06 was adopted in 1936.
For the full story on the US trials you need to read "Hatchers Notebook" by Julian Hatcher and for the ammunition history "US Military Small Arms Ammunition, Vol I" by Woodin, Hackley and Scranton.
Anyone interested in US military ammunition needs to have both Vol. I and 2 of the latter books. We have been waiting about twenty years for Volume 3, but I am assured by the authors not to worry, it will definitely be available some time in the next twenty years!
Pictures attached of British examples plus a US one for comparison.
Regards
TonyE
Attachments
Tony Williams
Well-Known Member
No they're not related to the .276 Enfield, which was a much bigger and more powerful beast.
An extract from here: http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk/Assault.htm
And another from here: http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk/The Next Generation.htm with the associated slide from my presentation
An extract from here: http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk/Assault.htm
And another from here: http://www.quarry.nildram.co.uk/The Next Generation.htm with the associated slide from my presentation
Tony
You'll find there are several variations of the Pedersen experimental and prototype cartridges with US headstamps. I doubt if you'll encounter more than the two basic ones, but both should be in your collection.
Both will likely be found with FA 29 headstamps. One has a large primer and the other a small primer.
Full cases of the 276 can still be found in the US,on occasion. Single boxes are often seen. At one time, years ago, the empty cases were sought after by wildcatters who converted them into a variety of wildcat cartridges.
Ray
You'll find there are several variations of the Pedersen experimental and prototype cartridges with US headstamps. I doubt if you'll encounter more than the two basic ones, but both should be in your collection.
Both will likely be found with FA 29 headstamps. One has a large primer and the other a small primer.
Full cases of the 276 can still be found in the US,on occasion. Single boxes are often seen. At one time, years ago, the empty cases were sought after by wildcatters who converted them into a variety of wildcat cartridges.
Ray
My .276 Pederson collection to show some of the examples and there are many. #1: cutaway; knurled cannelure; semi-rimmed case; small nickle primer; brass jacketed bullet; light propellant charge;;#1a are the headstamps and primers//#2: brass primer; fat case (notice the taper); common standard type; dummy w/o primer or headstamp; small nickle primer; small nickle primer;; #2a are the headstamps//#3: short case; short case; FAR headstamp; tracer bullet; AP bullet; dummy without primer and two diameter bullet; high pressure test; grooved case;;#3a are the headstamps.
My photography and camera leave something to be desired, but I hipe you can make most of it out.
My photography and camera leave something to be desired, but I hipe you can make most of it out.
Attachments
Part two of the Pedersons.
#4: British K30 .276; K30 .276 with copper primer; K29 .276; K30 .276 cupro-nickel clad steel jacket; GB 30 0.276; GB 30 0.276 with unique shaped "B" and "0";;4a headstamps//#5 K31 .276; K30 .276 popped primer dummy; K30 .276 dummy, wood rod insert; K30 .276 dummy without primer; K30 .276 unique wooden bullet blank.
There is also the short pistol case sized Pederson variation and that also comes in several types.
#4: British K30 .276; K30 .276 with copper primer; K29 .276; K30 .276 cupro-nickel clad steel jacket; GB 30 0.276; GB 30 0.276 with unique shaped "B" and "0";;4a headstamps//#5 K31 .276; K30 .276 popped primer dummy; K30 .276 dummy, wood rod insert; K30 .276 dummy without primer; K30 .276 unique wooden bullet blank.
There is also the short pistol case sized Pederson variation and that also comes in several types.
Attachments
Tony Williams
Well-Known Member
This could become confusing...:tinysmile_grin_t:
TonyE
HONOURED MEMBER RIP
FN 29? I bet you wish!
Tony - I might have a spare Pederson box. I will have a look.
Regards
TonyE