Counterfeit No 12 Grenades

**StuartBrown** · 10th May 2012, 08:33 AM

Looking at SgtLynn's excellent site I came across his expose of fake hairbrush grenades. It makes for very interesting reading and it seems to me that one of the fakers has corresponded with SgtLynn in an effort to convince him that the grenades were genuine. The correspondence is quite old and I wondered if any of the personalities, and the grenades, were still around.

See http://members.shaw.ca/dwlynn/no12/no12.htm

Stuart

**siegfreid** · 10th May 2012, 11:43 AM

The fake ones were around about 12 years ago & still turn up from time to time . One of the giveaways is the body dimensions are slightly wrong as is the fuze pocket . The chances of finding a real one with perfect provenance is remote in the extreme . To my knowledge , there are only about 4 in the UK outside of museums & about the same number in the US . Be VERY cautious if ever you are offered one . The genuine article would be worth at least 2K !! Hope this helps.

**Bonnex** · 10th May 2012, 05:19 PM

The other type of grenade 'found in the farmhouse' (or wherever) was a No 44 Anti-tank grenade in some quantity it would appear (given the number of fakes that were around). It must be very exiting to find find a box of exceptionally rare No 12s (from 1915) and a box of rare No 44s from 1918; the chances of course are absolute zero. The No 44s were pretty well made by a competent engineer but nevertheless are quite easy to spot.

It was a shame that the people who made these were deliberately deceiving collectors. Given the rarity of the real thing they could have marketed them as replicas and made a reasonably comfortable, and honest, profit. Collectors would have been happy to fill the gaps with a modern specimen I'm sure. As it happens those who bought them must have felt pretty upset when they found out and the item is never the same after that.

**paul the grenade** · 10th May 2012, 06:03 PM

here are some well made repros of the No12 and 44. the one on Daryls site has a very small box where as this one has a correct sized one. the 44 is the one mentioned by bonnex. they have No44 6/18 stamped on the top of the body and the date 6/18 on the brass transit plug. i bought these two when i didnt know any better

. but they are still nice to have.
cheers, paul.

**Bonnex** · 10th May 2012, 09:11 PM

[QUOTE=Bonnex;208064]...but nevertheless are quite easy to spot.

QUOTE]

I should have said "quite easy to spot if you have handled several genuine examples" which, I only just realise, most people have not.

**frizzen** · 10th May 2012, 09:15 PM

160.jpg 157.jpg 156.jpgThe real no12 shown on Daryls Grenade
Recognition site is mine. Here are a couple more photos, and also of my no44. As stated before, the detonator on the no12 is a repro (I made it myself). The most easily identifiable aspect of the fake 12's seem to be the color of the wood. Both of these grenades came from the same source, a defunct regimental museum. At one time there was a display of WWI Grenades. I'm sure both are original. Although these are the only examples I have ever had to examine, I am absolutely sure of the provenance. Neither of these came out of the UK. I first heard of the repro rumor about 7 or 8 years ago. As I understand it, the persons responsible for the fakes were going to test the waters with a couple of examples before extending their line. I don't know how many were made and sold, I've seen photos of two or three no 12's, they all looked the same. Hopefully there are not more of these out there. Also as stated, both of these types are so rare, even had they been identified as repro, they would have sold well to collectors with little hope of finding an original.....

**siegfreid** · 10th May 2012, 10:00 PM

Frizzen . Thanks for showing those pictures . Those are 100% correct & the other few in the US also came out of Regimental museums in Canada , I believe . I think the fake No12's had handles made of pine but the originals are a hard wood like ash or similar . Norman may be able to shed light on that aspect .

**Bonnex** · 11th May 2012, 11:44 AM

Mike,

I'm not sure about the wood type. The drawing just says "wood" and I don't have a copy of the specification. The ones I have seen were pretty course grained so it wouldn't surprise me if there were made out of the same wood as ammunition boxes, whatever that is.

There are some variations in the construction of the No 12. If I remember correctly Frizzen's has a cylindrical exploder container whereas others I have seen are rectangular and I know of two types of fabrication of the bodies.