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Help identifying an engraved name (maybe dutch?)

This is not the same person, the regimental number does not match.
 
Hoeksel said:
This is not the same person, the regimental number does not match.
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Hi Hoeksel...........yes you are correct, TimG 's post is not the same person, this may be causing some confusion? (I think TimG was kindly following up a previous post whilst we were still searching for a correct identity)

However, you yourself gave a link to a document which shows the right man!! Unfortunately, it does not give any more information on his Christian name or what happened to him. However what it does do is to give the information that he was part of Java Party 9 - this is a group of prisoners which were transported to Singapore as a 'group' aboard a ship. Delving deeper into the link it is possible to find more information on the ship itself, how many men were aboard and what happened to them when they arrived in Singapore. From this it is clear that the group of Prisoners were transported to Thailand to work on the Thai-Burma railway. It gives a list of dates when various trains left, but it is not possible to know which train he was on. (see attached photos below)

Unfortunately this is where my research ends. I cannnot find any more information about him. If I had a first name it would be easier of course, but unfortunately the link did not give that information. However now we know that the information on the box corresponds to the man in the list. De Koning appears to be a fairly common dutch surname, and indeed I have found several others on the lists given for other Java parties, but in the 11,497 names there are just several. Unfortunately again the list is incomplete, it would appear that some of the earlier parties also went to work on the railway but no list is available. The total number of Dutch pow's working on the railway is given as 17,990 (the missing name lists from Java would certainly come close to that figure, so a shortfall of approx 6,500 names of which one could assume there to be a few more, perhaps 4-7 'de Koning' amongst them). Of the 17,990 dutch pow's there were 2,782 deaths which accounted for 15% of the dutch workforce - this percentage is far less than that of the British and Australians working on the same railway. This could be for one of two reasons, it is said that the Dutch Pow's did not work on a section of railway which resulted in the highest casualty figures, but perhaps the greater reason is that these men were more used to living in the climate and knew more about the fauna which would provide a little extra food. I do not want to give the impression that these dutch POW's had it any easier, it is just that by sheer fortune they were better aclimatised to the natural conditions.
I am also faced with the issue of how complete or accurate records are. It may be that a record simply does not exist to fill in the details. It is also difficult to search for information in another language, which is why I initially asked for help. Online research tends to give results for the country of origin, unless you type in dutch, but unless you speak the language it can be problomatic as even with the use of translate errors occur.

I also want to say that research into this man is by no means complete, I would love to be able to find this mans record to know for certain what happened to him and indeed to know if his brother did indeed work on the railway too. Having a 'story' to a piece is only the start, proving the story is another thing. I feel that with the help of everyone on this thread it is now possible to say that the engraving on the box and the story so far runs true.........however I still need to fill in the missing pieces.

further help is more than welcome!!

kind regards Kev

H de Koning 1.jpgH de Koning 2.png
 
butterfly; I also want to say that research into this man is by no means complete said:
Hi Kev, It may be that you could find out more by going to your local library and checking whether `Ancestry' (normally pay to view but free in UK libraries) might have info for people of the Netherlands; also `Family Search' from the Church of Latterday Saints (Mormons), who have global records. For the Dutch members, do you have an organisational equivalent of the Commonwealth War Graves Commission (CWGC)? If you can find out where H de Koning came from, there may be more information about him in the area where he lived before he became a soldier.
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AMMOTECHXT said:
Hi Kev, It may be that you could find out more by going to your local library and checking whether `Ancestry' (normally pay to view but free in UK libraries) might have info for people of the Netherlands; also `Family Search' from the Church of Latterday Saints (Mormons), who have global records. For the Dutch members, do you have an organisational equivalent of the Commonwealth War Graves Commission (CWGC)? If you can find out where H de Koning came from, there may be more information about him in the area where he lived before he became a soldier.
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Hi thanks for that AMMOTECXT. I didnt know that Ancestry was free to access in libraries, will certainly look into that.

de Koning is, as I have been informed, a fairly common name, but there are still one or two things in my favour. The first is the 'story' that went with the item.......so far it has to some extent proved true. If it is true that this person did not survive then going on the dates engraved on it, he was likely to have died in either 1943 or 1944 - so checking both these dates may be a good starting point.

I havent given up on it yet, the fact that one record has come forward (with thanks to Hoeksel), then I feel others ought to exist. Unfortunately, the internet is all about how you type in your search and this being a dutch native may leave me at a disadvantage when it comes to records presented. It appears that when searching for information on the net your location also affects the results. Typing the name into a dutch site also presents problems as I dont understand the language - translate is good for limited use, but on a lengthy search has its limitiations.

It is nice to see that other members also have an interest in items which are outside the parameters of ordnance.

thanks once again
Kev
 
There may be family in the Netherlands (brothers, sisters, Children or grandchildren) still alive who could tell you more. One would have to look in the public record office, either the military records.
The Bronbeek KNIL retirement home / museum may have archives......
https://www.defensie.nl/onderwerpen/bronbeek

Regards, DJH
 
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These POW Trench art tins were normally made out of old water bottles. The Italians in North Africa probably made the most. Nice things to have.

John
 
Millsman said:
These POW Trench art tins were normally made out of old water bottles. The Italians in North Africa probably made the most. Nice things to have.

John
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Hi John,

I had not considered this as being a hand made piece, it is made of aluminium.
I have added a few more photos below to show the construction. It is a little dented but will remain exactly as it came to me, its a part of its history as far as I am concerned.

The more I look at it the more I appreciate the work that has gone into it, the engraving has been created by using the smallest tool, which is consistant throughout. (I have taken some close up photos but it is hard to do it justice)........and given the circumstances in which it was created its quite something else.

PB200725.jpgPB200726.jpgPB200727.jpgPB200728.jpg


z1 (1).jpgz1 (2).jpgz1 (3).jpg
 
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