Russian WWII 76mm Ammunition: Model 1927 Regimental Gun

[M8owner]

I have access to a great mount of 76x385 ammo these days due to my expanding list of contacts. Most of what I have seen appears to be HE of French manufacture, and I was wondering how the Russians used it in WWII because most of is coming out of Poland. I ran across this photo recently. It looks like they are feeding this little 1927 regimental gun with full size 76x385 ammo just like the French HE shells I am offered with RYG fuses. Previously, I thought this gun used one of the smaller Russian 76mm case varieties. I believe one of our members owns one of these guns in the UK. There is a very good post on the topic of Russian 76mm ammo at: http://www.bocn.co.uk/vbforum/threads/4228-Russian-76-2mm-tank-rounds/page3?highlight=russian+tank

I was looking for confirmation that the Russian 76mm 1927 gun uses full size 76x385 ammo. Thank you for your help.



Found the old post on this site. Rob owns one. http://www.bocn.co.uk/vbforum/threads/42287-New-addition?highlight=russian+76mm

 

[Nabob]

Hi according to my data the 76,2mm regimental gun 27 did not use french fuzes.
The Russians used fuzes AD, AD-2, AD-N, KT-3 or KTM-3.
The documentation says that about 25% of ammunition was manufactured as separate loaded with the propeling charge in shortened training cartridge cases (250 to 260mm).

Bob

 

[M8owner]

Thanks, Bob. Almost forgot to mention all this ammo was made in France under German supervision. I have a compete 353 round coming my way that has an RYG fuse with a waffenamt on it. That is why it is not in the Russian documentation.

Your picture makes it look like the 353 used a full size 385mm case but with a much reduced powder charge? It also looks like they marked the cases with the black stripe and "76-27".

 

[Nabob]

Yes the black stripe is a marker for reduced powder charge. Two thinner ones are also the option for different charge build-up.
As for french manufactured ammo it is a new information to me.
The firing tables HDv 119/118 from 1944 do not mention this ammo. Only russian made and german 7,62 cm Sprgr.Patr 39/2, 7,62 cm Gr.Patr 38/2 Hl/B and 7,62 cm Gr.Patr 38/2 Hl/C.

Didn't You mix up regimental guns 27 and 43? The later one had a short case (167 mm).

Bob

 

[M8owner]

I now understand that the 1943 regimental gun had the short case. I believe I have one of those cases inbound to me also. Do you have any ammo data for the 1943 gun, Bob?

 

[M8owner]

These are coming out of Poland with waffenamts on the fuses. That is the way they are found. All the cases have 1916 and 1917 dates - French (have Schneider on them) and Russian made.

 

[Nabob]

Here are some pages from 1949 manual.

Can You read the markings on the projectile or they are covered with blood?
And measure the precise diameter (preferably in milimeters) please.

Bob

 

[M8owner]

My Russian language skills are a little rusty since I last used them while visiting Russia in 1983.

 

[Nabob]

here a translation and the pictures listed in text:

2 Fixed ammunition for regimental gun mark 1943
Fixed ammunition with powder charge of 4/1 or 5/1 powder
Fixed ammunition with HE long range steel projectile and KTM-1 or KTMZ-1 fuze (shortened marking of the round -UOF-344- and inscription – only for 76-43- on cartridge case) Pict 13
Fixed ammunition with HE long range cast-steel projectile and KTM-1 fuze (shortened marking of the round -UOF-344A- and inscription – only for 76-43- on cartridge case) Pict 14
Fixed ammunition with HEAT steel projectile and BM fuze (shortened marking of the round -UBP-344M- and inscription – only for 76-43- - Shoot at armored targets- on cartridge case) Pict 15
Detailes on rounds are in Table fixed ammunition for regimental gun mark 1943 (Attachment 2)

So I guess there was no "old = french" style projectile used with regimental gun 43

Bob