German 50mm projos für AT-Gun & Tankcannon

[munfrosch]

My collected 50mm projo´s for AT-Gun Pak38 & Tankcannon, all from left to right.

1st pic:
5cm Gr. 38 Üb (HE)
5cm Pzgr. with KPS drivingbelt (APHE)
5cm Pzgr. with KPS drivingbelt (APHE), used for trials, some numbers and roman letters are left
5cm Pzgr. with FES drivingbelt (APHE)
5cm Pzgr. 39 (APCHE)

The 5cm Pzgr are not very common especially the KPS one, the most collectors do not even know this type of projectile´s or own one.

2nd pic:
Romain letters & handstamped number

3rd pic:
5cm Pzgr. 40 Anschuss (proof shot)
5cm Pzgr. 40 Üb (practice), without cap
5cm Pzgr. 40 (cored), without cap
5cm Pzgr. 40 (cored) with alloy cap, projo is restored
5cm Pzgr. 40 (cored) with bakelite cap

4th pic:
top view from 3rd pic

 

[RichardB]

Great collection Munfrosch.
You don't see many 5cm Pzgr (AP as opposed to APC). Nor the 5cm Pzgr.40 proof !
Do you ever collect cases, as they're also "impossible" in perfect condition.

It would be nice to see others 5cm collections.

Rich

 

[Tony Williams]

It would be nice to see others 5cm collections.

Here you are Rich - I happen to have them online in three different pictures:



Items 6 and 7 above - short and long-case 5cm rounds with APC projectiles



Items 3 and 4 above, both cases with Pzgr 40.

There is also a picture of the short-cased 5cm with HE projectile in this article, next to a Hotchkiss 6pdr, but I can't post the image URL for some reason: http://quarryhs.co.uk/alt WW2 tank gun.htm

 

[RichardB]

Great photos and collection Tony,
I think your website remains one of my bigger inspirations wrt to my ordnance interest, aside from being crazy about tanks all my life.

An interesting omission (not on your part) in the lower photo is the lack of any Tungsten cored US ordnance in the 37-57mm range. (Aside from the 4,2cm & 4,7cm German/Czech rounds, which ill no doubt get picked up on)

This begs the question, did the US ever use the 37mm Littlejohn or the 6PDR APDS, I assume not, but have never asked. can someone clarify? If that's the case, then were NO tungsten combat rounds in that range used by the US Tanks. (I'm excluding experimental). Perhaps this is because the M3 Lee/M4 Sherman active since 1941 already had 75mm main guns, so smaller calibre Tungsten rounds weren't of much value to them, but what about the 37mm and 57mm Anti-Tank guns?

Slightly off topic ramble, but what the heck

Rich

 

[auto151mg]

Here's some pictures of my two 5cm rounds

 

[Tony Williams]

This begs the question, did the US ever use the 37mm Littlejohn or the 6PDR APDS, I assume not, but have never asked. can someone clarify? If that's the case, then were NO tungsten combat rounds in that range used by the US Tanks. (I'm excluding experimental). Perhaps this is because the M3 Lee/M4 Sherman active since 1941 already had 75mm main guns, so smaller calibre Tungsten rounds weren't of much value to them, but what about the 37mm and 57mm Anti-Tank guns?

Not that I know of, Rich, but others may know better.

 

[Tony Williams]

Here's some pictures of my two 5cm rounds

Nice HE round - those shells are uncommon in such good condition.

 

[auto151mg]

I had two APC rounds. Traded one to member HarryG for some 35mm rounds.

 

[jeff w]

Great photos and collection Tony,
I think your website remains one of my bigger inspirations wrt to my ordnance interest, aside from being crazy about tanks all my life.

An interesting omission (not on your part) in the lower photo is the lack of any Tungsten cored US ordnance in the 37-57mm range. (Aside from the 4,2cm & 4,7cm German/Czech rounds, which ill no doubt get picked up on)

This begs the question, did the US ever use the 37mm Littlejohn or the 6PDR APDS, I assume not, but have never asked. can someone clarify? If that's the case, then were NO tungsten combat rounds in that range used by the US Tanks. (I'm excluding experimental). Perhaps this is because the M3 Lee/M4 Sherman active since 1941 already had 75mm main guns, so smaller calibre Tungsten rounds weren't of much value to them, but what about the 37mm and 57mm Anti-Tank guns?

Slightly off topic ramble, but what the heck

Rich

Hi Rich,
According to Steve Zaloga in his Osprey publication US anti-tank artillery 1941-45, in the late autumn of 1944 US 57mm anti-tank units began receiving small quantities of APDS from British stocks. Page 36 to be precise.
Great little book by the way if you are interested in how the US Army ended up with the AT equipment they used in WW2.

As far as American use of the 37mm Littlejohn - nope. Never used it, unless you consider the American M22 Locust which was sometimes fitted with it (but only in British service). If you have Hunnicutt's Stuart book he has a couple of good photos of it fitted. One with British Paras in the background, possibly taken at the Varsity landings in 1945. Muzzle velocity is given at 4000 feet per second! I'm guessing the 37mm squeezebore might make the top 10 "toughest WW2 AP service rounds to find list" (now that sounds like an interesting topic for a new thread...).

 

[Big Dave]

Think I bought a range recovered 37mm Littlejohn projectile off Dave (SG500) many moons ago ?

 

[jeff w]

Think I bought a range recovered 37mm Littlejohn projectile off Dave (SG500) many moons ago ?

Wow.
I'd imagine it is almost identical to a 2 pounder SB projectile, if it's not the same. Love to see a comparison between that and a 2 pounder SB.
This thread really got hi-jacked! Sorry.