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  1. #11
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    REALLY AWESOME INFORMATION, "I WAS THERE!" Thank you big time!

    Jason

  2. #12
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    does L23 uses W-Ni-Cu alloy, and L23A1 W-Ni-Fe ?

    L23A1 514mm length and 29mm diameter ?

    and L23 414-420mm length with same diameter ?

  3. #13
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    A version of the L23 (can't remember which) was used in the Gulf War of 1991. I saw - and had to move - a few hundred of them after hostilities had finished.
    Last edited by AMMOTECHXT; 28th May 2017 at 05:51 PM.
    Any live or dug ordnance shown in my posts has been dealt with accordingly by eod personel

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    apfsds (29th May 2017)

  5. #14
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    iwasthere,
    very interesting information. Can you say anything about few following UK APFSDS and it`s designations - XL21E1, C24 (both WHA), C11 and C31 (those two DU)? All tested in late 1977 during trilateral gun trials. And C10/11, from 1979?



    Wiedzmin,
    fFrom my readings UK interest in W-Ni-Fe penetrators started around 1979, because of circa 10% advantage in penetration over W-Ni-Cu. W-Ni-Cu, however, could be much easier to obtain by utilizing penetrators from APDS rounds. In 1979 it was said that UK would be ready to introduce new technology (W-Ni-FE) in 1984.

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    Wolchonok (31st May 2017)

  7. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Przezdzieblo View Post
    Wiedzmin,
    fFrom my readings UK interest in W-Ni-Fe penetrators started around 1979, because of circa 10% advantage in penetration over W-Ni-Cu. W-Ni-Cu, however, could be much easier to obtain by utilizing penetrators from APDS rounds. In 1979 it was said that UK would be ready to introduce new technology (W-Ni-FE) in 1984.
    thank you, i read W-Ni-Fe for british rods were similar to soviet VNG90(ВНЖ-90)?

    and L23A1 have OSD(Out of Service Date) in 2008 ?

    btw is there any info about alloy density for W-Ni-Cu used in L23 or in L15 ? and accurate measurements for L23 rod ?

    and of course penetration for L23 and L23A1, i often read it's something about 400-450/0 at 2km, but for such low and short rod, is it real ?

    p.s i tried find something in national archive, but reporst about L64 closed( only 1 available), and almost no reports about 120mm APFSDS ?

  8. #16
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    There is a lot of documents on 120 mm development, but it is sparsed in many files. F.e. files on trilateral gun trials contains some facts and some data. But in the most cases it is not specificly technical and development sources, rather material on internal UK policy. Blind searching from far far away might be costly and much fruitless.

    From circa 1987 doc from Bovington - L23 is said to penetrate 400+ / 2km, while new BD26 - 500+. BD26 was longer (540 mm, l:d 18,6:1) than L23 (l:d 14:1) and used W-Ni-Fe.

  9. #17
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    400/0 or 400 = 200/60 ? so it's something like 350-370/0 ?

    it's sound strange for such short and low round.

    3BM42 with 566mm dart(16:1?) get only 420/0(same W-Ni-Fe) at 2km. even DU 3BM32 only 430/0

    btw maybe you remember name of report about L23 and BD26 ?

  10. #18
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    Note that 3BM-42 got quite big velocity drop (AFAIR circa 100 m/s at 1000 m). In case of BD26 it was 55 m/s at 1000 m, I guess L23 could be similar. Also composite penetrator of 3BM-42 probably does not show its merits when the target is just RHA. IMHO it is not very strange situation and advantage of 3BM-42 over L23 fits well into imagination.

    The document you were asking for is titled "120 mm tank APFSDS BD26, unsolicited proposal". I noted it is from 1987, but marked it with the question mark, because it was not legible enough. So let say it is from 198X, where X is uncertain. Source - archives of The Tank Museum, box 623.45(41) on 120 mm ammunition.

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    Wolchonok (27th June 2017)

  12. #19
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    thank you


    something about L23A1

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    Przezdzieblo (28th June 2017)

  14. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wolchonok View Post
    thank you


    something about L23A1
    Nice find. And from which document is it?

 

 
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