Identification needed on these 50mm items

[imaokie2000]

I got these in a lot and the previous owner knew nothing about them.

I know the projectile does not belong with the case it is in, because the case is 50x330R with a head stamp "PATRONEFABRIK KARLSRUHE 1901". It's in tight and I won't mess with removing it unless I can find the proper projectile and/or case. I can not find any information on the 50mm case or the 50mm Canister.

As always, there's never just one, someone out there knows what they are. The canister has precut riflings in the driving band and it may not even be German. I'm wondering if this canister could possibly be a match for this case.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks
.....JR

 

[highlandotter]

.there is a 50x333R77.4 necked German Navy C/95. which sounds possible. 1895 era. the canister I couldn't guess, they are not common in Navy use. Flat on nose of projectile was common in that time range.

 

[pzgr40]

The projectile on the shellcase is a WW2 German 5cm Pzgr39 which does not belong on the shellcase for shure. It belongs on a 5cn Pak 38 or 5cm Kwk38 shellcase
Regards, DJH

 

[imaokie2000]

Thanks Guys. Like everyone else, I'm always looking for a certain projectile, case or fuze to complete a round. At one point, 3 or 4 years ago, I thought the pile of mismatched and incomplete items was getting smaller, but I was mistaken, that pile is getting huge............................... These are the only 50mm items I have in my collection, it'd be real nice to complete these.

Thanks
......JR

 

[earni74]

Hi JR, here is my 50x338mmR for comparison to your case, as you can see, my case has a small screw in primer (missing), the steel fuze plug needs to be replaced with the original fuze if I knew which one it was (can anyone tell / show me which fuze belongs to this round), the rim diameter is 78mm
MICK

 

[imaokie2000]

View attachment 132988View attachment 132989View attachment 132990View attachment 132991View attachment 132992Hi JR, here is my 50x338mmR for comparison to your case, as you can see, my case has a small screw in primer (missing), the steel fuze plug needs to be replaced with the original fuze if I knew which one it was (can anyone tell / show me which fuze belongs to this round), the rim diameter is 78mm
MICK

Thank you Mick, the rim dia on mine is 78mm also. There's 8mm difference in the total length of the cases. I wonder if I could assume the projectile would be proper in each case?????

Thanks
......JR

 

[earni74]

quite possibly as the dates are close
MICK

 

[Alpini]

Hello earni74/Mick,

your case isn't a german case. It's a 50x338,5R which was made for Denmark (export). Your projectile is a german 2nd WW target practise shell which was used on imaoki2000's 50x332,6R case. The plug is genuine for this shell.

Sorry, I don't have any info about the danish projectile.

 

[earni74]

Hi Alpini, you have thrown a spanner in the works with that, I must point out that the case is not semi rimmed, there are no stamps anywhere on the projectile which is very unlike anything German made.

I appreciate your comments and clearly need to do more research, in the paperwork I have (no photo though) that the dimensions of the case say its for a pillbox cannon, as for the projectile, I cannot definitely say its for this case, thanks, MICK

 

[imaokie2000]

Hi Alpini, you have thrown a spanner in the works with that, I must point out that the case is not semi rimmed, there are no stamps anywhere on the projectile which is very unlike anything German made.

I appreciate your comments and clearly need to do more research, in the paperwork I have (no photo though) that the dimensions of the case say its for a pillbox cannon, as for the projectile, I cannot definitely say its for this case, thanks, MICK

Mick, Alpini,

I sure appreciate your help. My Spanner is running in overtime, especially with the canister.:tinysmile_eyebrow_t

 

[imaokie2000]

I was searching thru my archives and ran across these photos showing two 50x332.6R rounds. I can not remember where I got the photos and I hope I don't step on anyone's toes for posting them. It's odd. I think one of these cases is actually the case I have now. I'm forgetting faster than I'm learning...............

 

[earni74]

that red proj round is the same as mine, I cant quite make out the stamps on the fuze, interesting, thanks for the pics JR
MICK

 

[greif]

View attachment 132988View attachment 132989View attachment 132990View attachment 132991View attachment 132992...., the steel fuze plug needs to be replaced with the original fuze if I knew which one it was (can anyone tell / show me which fuze belongs to this round), the rim diameter is 78mm
MICK

Your projectile has the right fuze, no need for replacement. These red projectiles were for target practice. A white band below the fuze hole indicated an inert filling, these projectiles were equipped with a drill fuze. A black band below the fuze hole indicated a smal explosive charge, these shells were equipped with the "E Kzdr f 5 cm" or "KZ f 5 cm". These fuzes could be made out of brass, aluminium or steel.

 

[earni74]

thanks greif the picture is very helpful, now I need to find the correct case for the projectile
Mick

 

[earni74]

Alpini, my apologies, I misread your post

 

[Hoeksel]

Found today, unfortunately trench-art and cut down, with a head stamp I have not seen before on this case. I believe it is Dutch navy pre-1900. The "1" is very typical for navy cases (no clue why) and it has a screw in steel dummy primer (in the style I have seen before with a Dutch navy case).

 

[charley777]

QUOTE... I must point out that the case is not semi rimmed ...UNQUOTE
I don"t think anyone is claiming a semi-rimmed case
I think it is a measurement thus...50 x 338.5 R and not 50 x 338 SR
If you see what I mean