What's new
British Ordnance Collectors Network

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

Advice needed, 120mm range pick up.

917601

Well-Known Member
I attended an MVPA show this weekend and met a retired tanker Colonel who has this for sale, he said it was German but used by US tankers. I need to make a fair offer. All comments, thoughts and remarks appreciated. Thank you in advance as I have no idea on where to start.
 

Attachments

  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    301.4 KB · Views: 106
  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    299.3 KB · Views: 74
  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    292.9 KB · Views: 77
Last edited:
For interest, pics of our MVPA meet held at the local VFW and Legion Post. I was able to get about 20 vehicles on display, and had about 400+ people show up. The 90mm AA gun is their yard ornament, dated 1943.
 

Attachments

  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    161.3 KB · Views: 38
  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    129.1 KB · Views: 33
  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    126.4 KB · Views: 34
  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    159.6 KB · Views: 34
Last edited:
That is a German 120mm training APFSDS. Same thing used in the M1A1, A2 Abrams. Don't go wild. Not uncommon, and not worth more than $200.
 
The parts seem to fit together well. That isn't the right case for that projectile though. That case is used with the long boom-tailed HEAT and TP-HEAT projectiles.

The correct case would have a much taller primer.
 
Last edited:
This is the German made and developed DM38 TPCSDS-T. The US copied this under license as the M865 TPCSDS-T. It is a target practice, range reducing round. The ported tail stabilizer uses the LKL Aerodynamic Principle where the holes are aerodynamically "Open" after being fired. With distance, the projectile slows and those tail stabilizer ports become aerodynamically "Closed." When this happens, the sub-projectile dart becomes aerodynamically unstable and it starts to tumble causing it to fall. This feature is designed to insure that the dart stays within target practice ranges. What you have is the very first version of the DM38. Later versions not only replaced the ported tail stabilizer with a flutter one but also the way that it attaches to combustible case adapter neck. Early versions like yours have a rubber seal ring and are bolted to the case adapter and fit over it. Later DM38 and M865 TPCSDS-T projectiles have a obturation band that, "Snaps" inside the case adapter. This one is not in great shape but I have seen them go from $250 to $800 with its sabot assembly in this shape. In the US, a DM38 is harder to find the the US variant M865.

Jason
 
Thank you for the information. The retired tanker states he "acquired " it while in Germany back in the 80's. It has been sitting in his footlocker for a long time.
 
Pics for interest. Thanks M8 for a valuation, I walked out his garage with it for $150, he agreed on my first offer. Being a range pickup, it comes with a story...he said he had found many Penetrator darts but they were all bent or missing the conical tail. It took a few assignments as range officer to find one intact. Hazord, you are once again correct about the head piece that came with it, it is marked TP-T M831.
 

Attachments

  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    104.2 KB · Views: 33
  • image.jpeg
    image.jpeg
    192.5 KB · Views: 25
Last edited:
Yes, a Shorland. It is due a repaint to original colors.
 

Attachments

  • image.jpeg
    image.jpeg
    220.7 KB · Views: 18
  • image.jpeg
    image.jpeg
    281.7 KB · Views: 20
  • image.jpeg
    image.jpeg
    200.8 KB · Views: 21
  • image.jpeg
    image.jpeg
    276 KB · Views: 19
Top