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early 37mm patronenfabrik headstamps

N

Neville_C

Member
Is it possible to give a date range for a 37mm cartridge case with the markings: PATR. FABR. * KARLSRUHE *? Note, there is no date or lot number, no flaming grenades (just stars), and no inspection marks. The case is attached to a 37mm Krupp-Gruson projectile. Would/could this be the correct case for the projectile? The case does not have crimps (correct for the Gruson round), and has the small primer. The shell is believed to have been brought back from South Africa after the Boer War - The Transvaal Staatsartillerie had four Krupp-Gruson 37mm mountain guns, and the OVS Artillerie one Krupp-Gruson field gun.

Any help with this would be brilliant. Thankyou.
 
An image would help. The case is consistent with the 1890s for export, no date is perhaps unusual. Which Gruson projectile is it
and is there any markings on it.
 
Thank you for your reply.
The Gruson projectile is the 1890s 3-cannelured drive-band pattern for mountain guns (the shorter version).

Gruson_37mm_001.jpg

Below is a photograph of a similar projectile, taken in Ladysmith in 1900. It is a crop from a larger image depicting shells used by the besieging Boers. For the photograph the Gruson has been incorrectly placed on a Vickers-Maxim cartridge (note the crimps).

Boer_shells_37mm_Gruson.jpg

Unhelpfully, there are no markings on the projectile.

Hope this helps.
 
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Here is another photograph of a Gruson projectile (next to a VSM 1-pounder), this time from an image of shells collected in the Kimberley area in 1900. This is the longer form of the projectile, as used by the Orange Free State Artillery in their single Gruson field gun.

Boer_Shells_Kimberley_pompom_and_Gruson.jpg

Gruson_gun.jpg


And one of a Gruson fuze, picked up in the Ladysmith area in 1900:

Boer_Shells_Ladysmith_Gruson_fuze.jpg
 
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My projectiles have no markings either, you certainly have the correct case for your projectile and the story too is likely correct given these documented
images..
I think a few countries used these as they have turned up in Japan (captured material likely) and I had one that was trench arted with
a Canadian badge so was likely from Belgium as a fortress gun with the long casing.

There was a 37mm cannon in canada that was very similar to the one you show except that it may have been remounted into a British carriage.
It used to live in Fort Henry 40 years back as a "German Anti tank gun" (ww1) But it has ended up in the U.S. where prices for such things are idiotic and it is
now lost.
 
That is excellent news.

Regarding the 37mm cannon you mention, five trophy guns from the Boer War were allotted to Canada in 1904. These included a 37mm Single Load QF Krupp-Gruson Gun, (Serial No. 41001), mounted on a carriage. It was issued to the Minister of Militia and Defence, Ottawa, on 17 Sep 1904. Could this be the gun that was a Fort Henry?
 
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