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Color of WW1 german 28 cm L4/4 shell

thekees

Well-Known Member
Recently i required a set of 28 cm L4/4 German WW1 HE shells, both navy. after removing 85 years of paint, i want to bring back the original paint and markings, however pictures, books etc, with WW1 German navy color shown are as scarce as hen's teeth. If somebody has pictures of the 1914-1918 color markings and special, if they had, further markings, like the white band applied in WW2 to indicate the center of gravity and post them here, i would be helped. Further, i'm looking for a fuse for this shell, Kz.f.Sprgr.m.K.u.St.
 
I think they should be yellow, the common German HE color, black cap or tip, and a black band, seen pictures with the marking in old lettering " SP E " but have to confirm it. Any help is welcome. Both shells are HE, equipend with a bodem zunder and Kopfzunder (not installed ) and marked with serial numbers 5122 and 5023, and marked Kr18 with a kaiserliche marine mark. any pictures from ships, ammo handling or whatever, even in B/W should be great. And of course, it is acquired, not required, stupid auto correction.
 

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Hi thekees, fabulous find, if you ever decide to part with one of them... I'll be willing to help, just let me know how much! All the best, Frank
 
Hello,

I'm little bit confused with the shape of your shells.
28cm L4.4 I can find in my doc are different : one piece ballistic cap

French ww1 diagram :

28cm ww1.jpg

German ww2 diagram :
28.jpg


other ww2 with three bands and short cap :
3.jpg
 
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Thanks a lot, the cap is one cap, put together consisting of the adapter and the haube, both steel. at shell 1 these are welded as one piece, the other looks like spot welded. you see two grooves in the picture of the shells, one is between shell and haube, the other is between the adapter of the haube and the cap. The latter is fixed, since the shells are late WW1, both marked with Kr 18 and the M, i guess it was a easier way to make adapters. Thanks for the pictures, still i'm curious if in WW1 more markings were applied accept for the black tip and ring.
 
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Checked the Haube and the markings, serial number and Kr18 are on the part between the grooves, and on the body of the shell, so it's a match as we say, will look further for pictures with these shells, a new era for me, and not a light era too.
 
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The Sp E marking should read Sp.F. This was used for 24 cm shells and only marked such when filled with Swartz Pulver, hence the Sp. F.b Further i've checked the dimensions and they are spot on the specifications as given in the French data sheet. on the other datasheet, the driving bands are way to small compared tothe shell, think its a mistake there, the 14 mm is the gap between the bands. They are looking better now, in the correct yellow and black. still not finished, have to clean all driving bands and fineline the painting.
 

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Today i recieved a new book, "GERMAN NAVAL GUNS SHELLS & EXPLOSIVES FUSES & EXPLODERS", what a title. perfect book for the WW1 German naval collectors. Together with the book "german notes on shells", dated 1918, the answer on the two piece ballistic cap is also given. Most likely, to save machine hours and material, the haube was produced in a small adapter on a lathe, completed by a pressed steel cap, welded on it. An example is given in the first book, at the 24cm L4/7 shell, exactly compared with these two shells. So, highly recommended this book!
 
Finally parked them on there location. Next to the two 28 cm German L2/8 shells and an 17 cm PSGR, they look impressive enough. The gap on the left, the 24 cm and 21 cm, not speaking the gap on the right, 30,5 and 38 cm, is the goal for 2018.
 

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Nice ones Kees, perhaps it would be nice to mention the source!!!!! hahahahaha regards Ben
 
Ben, lets say it is de "hofleverancier".

As you see there is some more room for an 38!
 
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Burney, your remark about reworked for WW2 let me look further for pictures and specifications. Finally on a discussion on another forum, the Axis history forum, in a topic about ammunition, i found this picture. When you zoom in on the driving bands, they are exactly the same and when you look good, under the hand of the boy, you see the tipical WW2 marking of a double installed fuse, the double arrow. When you look at the haube, the same construction can be seen as on my two shells. Since the gun is a 28 cm SKL/45, a WW1 gun, mostly reused as coastal artillery in WW2, it all make sense now.

MinenAz16, the second picture in your response at topic no. 4, do you have a kind of source of it?

Next project is to find a WW1 38 cm shell for the "lange Max', if anyone has an idea where to start, please contact me, thanks in advance.
 

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Next project is to find a WW1 38 cm shell for the "lange Max', if anyone has an idea where to start, please contact me, thanks in advance.

There was one for sale on 2dehands.be some 2/3 weeks ago. Asking price 1600 euro. Advert no longer active so probably sold (no idea for how much it eventually went).

Regards, Jan
 
Jan,

Thanks, however that was the cartridge case, i'm looking for the shell itself, the one of about 750 kg.
 
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