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  1. #1
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    Brandt mortar Fuze(Unknown place of production)

    Who can tell me its origin information?

    Marking: I. R.
    Size of screw thread:UN 113/128-12-Right.
    It is different from the screw thread size of French fuze.
    -
    The fuze from the China Battlefield(WWII),but the origin and manufacturing time are unknown.

    The internal spring is severely corroded, resulting in complete decay. This is repaired by DIY.
    C360_2018-08-30-14-54-02-664.jpgC360_2018-08-16-20-35-10-118.jpgC360_2018-08-13-17-36-09-559.jpgIMG_20180914_024236.jpg
    Last edited by Jibarium; 13th September 2018 at 07:59 PM.

  2. #2
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    Hi Jibarium,
    what you have is a French projectile fuze called V18 IR. I for Instantanée (instantaneous) and R for Retardée (delay).


    Yoda
    Any live or dug ordnance presented by me has been disposed of by EOD technicians.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yodamaster View Post
    Hi Jibarium,
    what you have is a French projectile fuze called V18 IR. I for Instantanée (instantaneous) and R for Retardée (delay).


    Yoda
    But this kind of fuze was also produced in China during the period of the Republic of China (1912~1949). It was copied by 21st(Chongqing) & 40th(Liuzhou,Guangxi/Kwangsi) Ordnance Arsenal and provided to 60mm & 83mm & 82mm mortar shells.

    Moreover, the screw thread size of the fuze(UN113/128-12-R) is totally different from that of the standard fuses made in France(Whitworth 55º- M23x2mm).
    This fuze, no arsenal marking.
    So I am puzzled by which country the fuze is copied.
    -------
    During the period of the Republic of China, China civil war(1912~1937 and 1946~1949) and Second Sino-Japanese War(1931~1945) (including World War II).
    --------
    The fuze data(China data):
    IMG_20180905_171044.jpg
    Last edited by Jibarium; 15th September 2018 at 09:00 AM.

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    doppz92 (16th September 2018), MINENAZ16 (15th September 2018)

  5. #4
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    What are the thread measurements of the chinese fuze ?

    Can it not be a Chinese fuze without arsenal marking ?

    Other question : should you have a listing of the Chinese manufactory codes ?




    Yoda
    Last edited by Yodamaster; 15th September 2018 at 02:31 PM.
    Any live or dug ordnance presented by me has been disposed of by EOD technicians.

  6. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yodamaster View Post
    What are the thread measurements of the chinese fuze ?

    Can it not be a Chinese fuze without arsenal marking ?

    Other question : should you have a listing of the Chinese manufactory codes ?




    Yoda
    The thread pitch of fuzes(4 pcs.) is 1/12 inch in the photo :
    C360_2018-09-16-14-15-58-996.jpg
    Type 14 37mm fuze Data:
    mmexport1531307768757.jpg

    The Chinese manufactory codes Marking:
    C360_2018-09-16-14-36-58-799.jpg
    C360_2018-09-16-14-38-04-536.jpg
    C360_2018-09-16-16-01-35-212.jpg
    C360_2018-09-16-16-02-40-861.jpg
    Last edited by Jibarium; 16th September 2018 at 09:28 AM.

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    doppz92 (16th September 2018), MINENAZ16 (16th September 2018), Nabob (19th September 2018), Yodamaster (16th September 2018)

  8. #6
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    Hello,

    You have a nice book on Chinese fuzes !
    Maybe you already know, third fuze on your picture is an adaptation of Japanese Type-88, last fuze is known in US doc as Type-9.

    Regards
    Any Live or Dug ordnance shown by me has been disposed of by EOD personnel .

  9. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by MINENAZ16 View Post
    Hello,

    You have a nice book on Chinese fuzes !
    Maybe you already know, third fuze on your picture is an adaptation of Japanese Type-88, last fuze is known in US doc as Type-9.

    Regards
    Interestingly, The third fuze you mentioned is that the year marking format of the fuze is mukden's, and the thread is Whitworth 55º-15/16-12-left (thread size used by the Mukden arsenal), which is different from the Japanese M24*2mm-left (Type 88 large fuze).

    I discussed this Fuze on IAA forum:
    https://forum.cartridgecollectors.or...he-china/29954
    Last edited by Jibarium; 17th September 2018 at 05:03 AM.

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  11. #8
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    Any Live or Dug ordnance shown by me has been disposed of by EOD personnel .

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    doppz92 (17th September 2018)

  13. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by MINENAZ16 View Post
    C360_2018-09-17-20-02-53-873.jpg
    C360_2018-09-17-20-05-19-645.jpg
    C360_2018-08-18-22-55-52-553.jpg
    C360_2018-08-18-22-53-12-507.jpg
    C360_2018-07-31-13-57-57-659.jpg
    About fuzes of photo:
    The structure of this Unknown fuze is the same as that of Type-88, but the thread specifications are different from those of Japan. Although no type information was found in the search data, the thread of this fuze is the same as the whitworth55º-15/16''(DIA)-12(TPI)-L thread of type 14 fuze made by mukden.
    This fuze and Type 14 fuze have the same year marking format(both are year marking format of the fuze is mukden's) .
    -
    Unknown fuze and Type 14 Mukden's fuze:
    C360_2018-07-31-22-51-30-640.jpg
    Type 14 Mukden's fuze data:
    mmexport1531307768757.jpg
    So I can judge that the unknown fuze and Type-88 can not be used because of different threads. According to the Chinese arsenal's habit of copying ordnance, they usually rename the type, so the fuze is not type-88.
    This is a very interesting discovery.
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------
    The "八二'' marking fuze is installed on the Chinese Type 31 60mm mortar shell:
    5BB1F3CD48DB3C6F7DB63BE95C3589A8.jpg
    1C1ACD9FD698ECFB77CD8B6E0BE0FCB4.jpg
    A57B1E85D00C8923DC67BE6CEE1C6D37.jpg

    The size of the "八二" marking fuze is the same as that of the data you gave, and the size of the thread is the same.Thank you!
    Last edited by Jibarium; 17th September 2018 at 09:22 PM.

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    doppz92 (17th September 2018)

 

 

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