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115 mm Cartridge from 4.5 inch mk 6 gun

S

soldier66

Member
Its copper shell caliber 4.5inch,the total hight is 64 cm and on top of the cartridge it has 3 rings.
The detonater is type N43 mk2, Foto's wil follow later.
I started searching on google but there where several guns, so the guestion is what type of gun and at what periode this was used.

soldier66
 
This case is for the 4.5" Mk 5 gun as fitted to the Royal Navy Tribal Class Frigates that were built in the 1950s.
 
I would say that is very expensive for the UK. They normally go for about 30-40. There is one on specialist auctions at the moment

I'm not sure what the market is like in holland

I bought a mint case and unfired projectile for a 4.5 Mk8 gun for 90 a couple of years ago in the UK
 
As a matter of interest, there are two different neck types for this case - one has the annular "crimps" as shown, the other is a conventional straight neck. I have heard various stories to account for this. Does anyone have a definitive answer?
 
Hi Tony Dont understand the 2 neck types you are talking about do you have any pictures? I worked at RNAD Trecwn from the mid 60s filed 1000s of this type of cases Yours Steve
 
Tony,

The very early guns had a fixed round and the later guns had a separate round. This would explain two different neck types.
 
I think I've solved it now. I took a closer look at my case, and while the outside of the neck looks smooth, the inside shows a trace of the annular grooves. Presumably these were flattened out during firing?
 
The annular groovees are in fact a whoping great thread into which a black plastic bung screws.
 
Hi Tony as you say the very early marks were fixed rounds
2 The Dutch case is from the Van Speijk class very similar to our Leander class
3 After filling the case with propellant a soft metal lid was glued and screwed in place (used to clean the barrel as no tinfoil was used in the charge)
4 Did not notice any difference with the mouth of the returned fired case

Hope this info helps
 
Pictures are worth thousands of words....

4.5-1.JPG


4.5-2.JPG


4.5-3.JPG
 
Hi Tony yes like you say its a fixed round
1 There is a faint black ink HE ( Type of round only marked on case of a fixed round
2 The primer only has 2 slots should have 4
3 The case stamped marking are not correct for a SL

hope this info helps
 
Aha, thank you gentlemen - now we're getting somewhere. My case is c.700mm long.

The 4.5 inch ammo went through three iterations that I'm aware of: when first developed, it was fixed. It was soon found during WW2 that the fixed ammo was too big and heavy for easy manhandling so the ammo was separated. It remained separated through the postwar era (in the classic box-shaped Mk 6 twin gunhouse) until the advent of the autoloading Mk 8 gun in c.1970 as currently used (in modified form) to this day, when the ammo became fixed again for rapid auto handling (and I suppose with a longer neck to grip the shell).

Given the date on my case, it is presumably for the Mk 8 gun. So all the shorter ones with the annular grooves are for the earlier guns?
 
Hi Tony had another good look at the case photo
1 The primer is a N44 only fitted to a Mk8 round

hope this info helps
 
Greetings...
4.5" Mks 1, 3, 4............... 113x640R (UK Naval so-called 4.5" actually 4.45" = 113.03mm)
4.5" Mks 2, 6 ...................113x696R
4.5" Mk 8 .........................113x700R
I have a feeling that the Norwegian cases for the Vickers 11.4cm L/45 are 635mm long. Any comments from anyone?
Likewise the Dutch Mk 5 Vickers possibly 635mm long.
 
Thanks for that, Charley.

Your info raises a couple of questions in my mind. I would have expected the fixed ammo to need a longer neck to get a firm grip on the shell, so the cases should be longer overall. Yet the Mk 1 (which was supposedly fixed) is shown as being shorter than the later versions, which were separated. I am baffled...can anyone explain?
 
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