20mm cartridge ID

[movingblade]

Hi All
My son has just starting collecting and has a 20mm cartridge - case only, it's headstamped ROF Radway Green manufacture: RG 20mm 51, however case is also stamped: TH 81 53 SAFIR IZ.

We would welcome any advice as to meaning of latter
Many thanks

 

[SG500]

Hi would you mind posting a photo of the case and also the headstamp please.
Ta,
Dave.

 

[TonyE]

20mm

It will be a 20mm H ispano case made at Radway Green in 1951 as you say. The other stamping, which I assume to be above the extractor groove, is the loading data.

TH - ROF Thorpe Arch
81 - Lot Number
53 - loading date
SAFIR 1Z - This is the load data. Are you sure this is correct, as it indicates semi-armour piercing incendiary explosive Mark 1Z? I thought Hispano only came in semi-AP/I and explosive incendiary.

Regards
TonyE

 

[movingblade]

Hi Tony/Dave
Many thanks for yr quick replies I have attached pics of the case markings and I was wrong - its SAP not SAF although it does appear to end IZ
B.Rgds
Mark

 

[Andysarmoury]

20mm case

Hi TonyE, excuse me for butting in but i too have a case like that head stamp RG 20mm 56 and on the side of the case are BMR 8/58 SAPIR 2Z can anybody tell what type of bullet it would have had or a pic please.
Cheers
Andy

 

[Chris 42 RQ]

Sapir

Your case is for SAPIR Semi Armour Piercing Incendiary Replica.

Two eamples shown below, ignore the non original paintwork.
The red with white tip is SAPI and the other is SAPIR also know as REP-SAPI

 

[Andysarmoury]

Thanks Chris, have you any ideas where i can get one.
Cheers
Andy

 

[tomsk]

20mm Id

Im probably going to be corrected here but i thought SAPIR 1z was semi armour piercing incendiary representative as this fired example in the photo.
sorry for butting in
regards
tomsk

 

[movingblade]

Thanks Tomsk
I could be wrong but I'm guessing if these are representative rounds they were for training and if so inert filled and dummy fired in the weapon (hence the firing pin mark )? I'm wondering if this is correct
Cheers
Mark

 

[Chris 42 RQ]

Thanks Tomsk
I could be wrong but I'm guessing if these are representative rounds they were for training and if so inert filled and dummy fired in the weapon (hence the firing pin mark )? I'm wondering if this is correct
Cheers
Mark

SAPI is filled and most definately lethal if messed with whilst SAPIR or REP-SAPI is inert filled with a chalk like or wax filling.
Both are fully functioning fireable rounds.

 

[movingblade]

Thanks to everyone - this has been very informative for us and Chris' comments have been helpful re the safety aspects (We have had a look at the thread about the care needed re ensuring projectiles are inert!!)
Cheers
Mark