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British Hotchkiss 6 Pounder Case Headstamps

P

peregrinvs

Well-Known Member
Hi,

I picked this 6PR case up today as it was very reasonably priced and I was mildly intrigued by the markings: specifically, why isn't it marked '6PR' and with a year of manufacture?

I'd also be grateful if someone could translate the other markings as I don't recognise most of them. I can see it's a MkIII, had a cordite fill and has a VSM Sept '14 made No.2 MkIII primer, but beyond that I've little idea.

Many thanks,
Mark
IMG_3205.JPGIMG_3207.JPGIMG_3208.JPGIMG_3209.JPGIMG_3206.JPG
 
it does have the date of manufacture thats what the 20 9 99 is, but it later had the conversion to MK III with a screw in primer in time for WWI when it was re filled
 
cant really help, but by way of casual observation could the date not be 20/9/1899 ?

just a thought

regards Kev

looks like 2pounder beat me to it - LOL !!!!!!!!!
 
2pounder said:
it does have the date of manufacture thats what the 20 9 99 is, but it later had the conversion to MK III with a screw in primer in time for WWI when it was re filled
Click to expand...
Thanks for that. Kind of logical in hindsight... Interesting that it's a conversion - what type would it have been when manufactured in 1899?
 
Hi All,

Nice case, peregrinus; looks like it was made by Birmingham Metals & Munitions in 1899 (as 2 Pdr says), but I think it was made as a Mk.III (with the thinner percussion cap as indicated by the 1 in circle), and later converted to a Mk.III* with the screw-in primer, with the result that the "1 in circle" was barred out. Loaded with a full charge of cordite, fired, then sent back to a factory, where it was annealed (the A in circle with a dot after it, the E 25 being the lot), after which it was loaded with another full charge of cordite and fired.

For some reason many of the earlier cases did not have the calibre marked on them; I think they only started doing this sometime in the 1900s, but not sure exactly when.

Regards,
Roger.
 
Just adding some trivia to Roger's excellent decode. The date stamp is the date of acceptance by an Army Inspector (using the personal number 2) on behalf of the Admiralty (N for Navy of course). I believe it is the case that Naval inspectors did not stamp the date.

In the rework lot number (E 25) the E likely indicates the factory that did the work but I am at a loss to know what factory (or RNAD) E represents unless it is RNAD Ernesettle. There is also a suggestion in Naval handbooks that a letter under a rework stamp is a date code. Food for some research I suggest.
 
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Bonnex,

I believe in this instance, 'E' is the year of annealing and 25 is the Lot No.

Regards

TimG
 
Thanks Tim. I did read that in one of the handbooks but it did not give the decode. I wonder if it is as easy as E = 1905!!
 
Norman,

That would be too easy! I'm sure, somewhere, I have the decode. To complicate matters, if this was a low temperature annealed case (An 'A' within a lozenge) it would signify Batch and Lot number.

TimG

P.S Just found a publication that states 'Z' is 1935. However, it contadicts another one regarding low temp' annealing.
 
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Tim,

It seems to be a subject worthy of a pamphlet in itself.

The contradiction that you mention, is that between two publications of a similar date? I ask because I wonder if there were subtle changes in the marking scheme. I dont have enough handbooks to track changes let alone subtle ones.
 
Thanks for the further input - I love the amount of history these old cartridge cases can give you. Newer picture with the remaining grot cleaned off the base:
IMG_3213.JPG
It was purchased on a bit of a whim and - whilst I have no idea of their relative desirability - I'd rather have a WWI dated land service marked 6PR case. So if anyone would be interested in doing a swap or part exchange, let me know.

Cheers,
Mark
 
Norman,

The contradiction appeared to be between 'Textbook of Ammunition 1926' and the 1936 edition. However, having now taken time to read the text in the latter, it merely reiterates the former in that the letter signifies the year. The error would appear to lie with the artist who has drawn and labelled a cartridge headstamp stating otherwise in the later edition.

Regards

Tim
 
I forgot to ask - are 6PDR Hotchkiss cases converted to a screw-in primer scarce / rare? I ask as having browsed through various pictures of 6PDR cases on the web, they almost always seem to have a push-in primer.
 
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