Depleated Uranium

[peteblight]

Just thought i'd post some pics of some DU rounds as we don't seem to have too much DU related stuff on here.

Pic 1 - A10 round and gun.

Pic 2 - DU round with sabot intact

Pic 3 - Fired DU round

Pic 4 - Result of a DU round hitting armour - Note the characteristic spatter to the right of the hole.

 

[SG500]

Thanks for posting those photos Pete.

Why the spatter marks shown on the last photo? I'd assumed these heavy metal cores just went straight through, or do they burn their way through too?

So what's the line with health effects following exposure to DU? Would an unfired core be bad for you (I'm assuming its on a table in front of you not travelling towards you at a zillion miles per hour) or is it only when it hits something and produces a lot of dust. Is it the radiation that is bad or the toxic dust from the metal..........there seem to be conflicting ideas out there on the web?

Dave.

 

[peteblight]

I've got a couple of presentations on DU somewhere, i'll have a look through tomorrow and post some info.

 

[HAZORD]

Great photos Pete, thanks for posting!

There are a few different alloys of DU being used for ammunition. Do you have any info about the effects to targets and humans of the different alloys?

 

[V40]

Here is a basic site with basic information:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depleted_uranium#Military_applications

 

[Lou]

I heard about a dude that picked up a fired projectile and kept it in the pocket of his bdu's when he was in the gulf,for good luck. Someone said his next two youngsters were born with flippers.

I dont want anything to do with that kinda Ord.

 

[al'saad]

Here are some quotes on DU from one of my researches related to the environmental destruction caused by munitions remnants:

The most controversial remaining of the war is depleted uranium (DU) munitions
leftovers. These leftovers are not explosive i.e. they are not nuclear explosive and they do not contain any explosive charges. Depleted uranium, or U238 isotope, is the byproduct of the uranium based nuclear fuel and nuclear explosive production process-uranium enriching. It is used for military purposes because of its mechanical characteristics (high specific weight, hardness and firmness) and pyrophoric capabilities, particularly in kinetic penetrating munitions for anti-armor combat. DU is not considered as ERW because of its lack of explosive charge, upon which it does not provide threat based on destructive and lethal potential as typical UXO. Potential harmfulness and lethality of DU remaining is based on its radiological and chemical toxicity and pollutions is caused by large quantities of DU munitions used in a conflict. Use of this ammunition is especially characteristic for aircraft mounted rapid fire guns as GAU-8/A used on US made A-10 aircrafts which fire 70 30mm DU rounds per second."

"Particular form of the pollution of the environment by the substances present in the
ERW is pollution by the depleted uranium or DU. DU is the uranium isotope U238 used in
conventional weapons as kinetic penetrater in high velocity armor piercing rounds due to
its physical characteristic and phyrogenic abilities. Even if DU is not nuclear explosive18,
and is 40% less radioactive, it has toxic characteristic which appear trough its high
mutagenic, neurotoxic, carcinogenic, and leukemagenic characteristics, and also very long
half-life of 4.5 million years, which means that DU effect is very long term. Humans may
be affected by the DU by being wounded by DU fragments, trough inhalation or ingestion
of the particles spread in the air, and trough food chain by DU solutions absorbed by herbs
and animals trough water and soil. Spread of the DU effect is registered in radius of several
kilometers around place of use of such ammunitions where appearance of carcinomas and
leukemia is above average. This is usually called ‘Gulf War Syndrome’ as such pattern is
firstly noticed at the First Gulf War Veterans. Even if interdependence of higher number of
carcinomas and leukemia and use of DU ammunitions is never scientifically proven (Bem
and Bou-Rabee, 2003), relations of the patterns of use of DU ammunitions in Iraq and
Kosovo and increased number of diseases related to toxic characteristic of DU are obvious.
In Iraq between 1991 and 2000, number of ill by leukemia raised for 366% and number
birth deformations for 400%, and in Kosovo number of carcinomas raised for 200% after
1999 (Hindi at all, 2005). In Bosnia and Herzegovina DU munitions are used on 14
locations but only area of TRZ Hadžici (former military industry facility) is surface cleared
from the DU ammunitions remaining by the Sarajevo B FACP demining team. Following
NATO reports on this location is fired 3400 rounds of aircraft DU ammo, and following
FACP database 683 pieces of DU rounds are removed during clearance operation. It is
assumed that rest remained deep in the ground. Also, medical reports show 4 times higher
mortality at the population inhabited near TRZ Hadžici during NATO strikes (Durkovic
2003)."

 

[peteblight]

When people hear about DU there's this immediate sense of fear. People hear all sorts of stories about DU and the hazards and health effects associated with it, but in reality once you know more about it, how to handle/deal with it and what the potential health effects are, then it poses no more risk than working with HE rounds and certainly a lot less than CW filled ammunition.

DU emits alpha, beta and gamma radiation - The alpha is stopped by your skin, the beta only travels a few centimeters and is stopped by clothing, paper etc. The gamma is more penertrating, but the gama emitted from DU is very low level and poses no more of a hazard than natural background radiation.
The hazard from DU ammunition is when it's been fired and strikes a hard target and you inhale or ingest material from the area of impact (armour, buildings etc). This then enters the body and the alpha and beta particles remain inside irradiating you from the inside out. This can easily be stopped by wearing respiratory protection and showering after working in a contaminated area.

Unfired and complete fired DU rounds pose only a very, very small directional radiation hazard.

Hope this is helpful, there's lots of info out there on the world wide interweb, some very accurate and some completely misleading.

Here's a few more pictures too.

Pic 1 - 120mm DU APFSDS round.

Pic 2 - Fired CHARM 3 round that didn't hit a hard target.

Pic 3 - Corroded DU penetrator

Pic 4 - Corroding DU fragments

Pic 5 - Sabots form A10 DU rounds

 

[peteblight]

Just to clarify things, i completely agree with what Al'saad says, i'm talking from a handling and clean up point of view.

Pete

 

[SG500]

Thanks for all the feedback guys, its good to hear it straight from the experts rather than relying on misinformation on the web.
As for your photo 1 in the last but one post Pete......NICE!!
Dave.

 

[al'saad]

the greatest challenge i have encountered related to DU is combined UXO/DU clearance because in DU contaminated areas you can not perform demolition on situ neither high or low order. in fact you can not risk any kind of soil disturbance which can airborn DU oxide dust or DU particles.

 

[peteblight]

Here's a picture of a DU round next to a radiation monitor - As you can see, this undamaged DU round is giving 0.67 microsieverts per hour at 2-3cm. The monitor has to be this close as the radiation won't travel much further.

Putting this into prespective:

- In the UK, a classified radiation worker can receive upto 20 millisieverts per year during the course of their work (this doesn't take into account naturally occuring background radiation) and the monitor is showing 0.67 MICROsieverts.

 

[SG500]

WOW getting technical now - so with my basic maths would I be right in calculating:
Number of hours in a year is about 8766 hours
Number of microsieverts in a year would be 8766 x .67 = 5873 microsieverts
Divide by 1000 to get to millisieverts = 5.873
so........you could sit next to one of these every hour all year and still only be exposed to a quarter of the permitted dosage of a radiation worker.
It puts it all into perspective.
Dave.

 

[pointblank0]

So, I take it the white powder found on the inside of Iraqi tanks in the first Gulf after being hit by DU rounds, is powder from the projectile caused by the impact, and this powder would be less safe as it has broken down?

 

[hicky1300]

Hi all have read all this with great interest especially as I come acroos DU fairly often as a lot of older aircraft have some large lumps of DU on them.
As already stated the actual rads emitted are low & easily shielded against.
The nasty stuff though is when it is corroding or some muppet decides to drill or grind it!!
The dust from deteriorating DU or worked stable DU is very nasty if inhaled, ingested or enters through a cut/wound.
So word to the wise if you have any that is corroding - bin it - depending where you are this may be a problem to do responsibly.
If you have any that is sound & solid DO NOT start trying to section it or work it in anyway. If you must mount it use an adhesive not drill & tap.
If anyone is interested it is used on aircraft for balast & on flying controls as counterweights & the manuals are full of do`s & dont`s - mainly dont`s!!
Again as stated previously on this thread it is used due to its high weight to low volume. Namely a little weighs a lot. Tungsten is used mainly now as an alternative

 

[peteblight]

The only way to be 100% sure that suspected DU contamination is really DU contamination is to use a radiation monitor.

 

[US-Subs]

As mentioned, the safety is directly related to the entry of the particles into the body. DU is an alpha emitter, alpha is not capable of penetrating a sheet of paper, or the skin. If you handle it, wash afterwards. If you are near exposed and oxidising material, wear respiratory protection. In an unfired projectile it is safe to handle and be near.

In regard to the health risks of DU in various combat areas, it has already been said that this is contraversial. That is because it is unproven to have caused the health issues attributed to it by some on a broad scale. I have handled DU, EU and other related materials on many occasions. I have collected DU on test ranges, in the Gulf and in Bosnia. I am not saying that it is nice stuff, any radioactive material need to be treated with respect, as do all energetic and toxic materials. But I am against drawing unfounded conclusions. I.E. blaming DU for Gulf War Illness is ridiculus. For those of us that were in Theater, there were dozens of more likely candidates for any number of illness, from the prophylactics given to the air being breathed.

In regard to cancer clusters in former combat areas and war zones, DU, while one toxic material used in limited amounts, is far from the only one. TNT is also considered by many as a serious carcinogen. It's not as sexy as DU though, so it is ignored. In many of these areas mentioned the ground was also being poisoned by many other elements - sometimes intentionally.

Again, I'm not saying DU is harmless, but let's keep this in the realm of factual information and leave the speculation to others. I know of a number of DU pieces in collections, I see no difficulty with that as long as it is treated appropriately. A better question is the legality in the various countries.

 

[Jagd301]

30x173 PGU14B Depleted Uranium Shell Casing.

Heres a 30mm DU shell case fired from an A10 Warthog during Desert Storm in 1991. It was given to an RAF Tornado pilot after the ceasefire. I was told they are quite rare and cost around 145! I got this case for just 5 from a mail order surplus dealer years ago. Note the white stencilling on the lower part of the case "Depleted Uranium". DU is pretty dangerous stuff mainly from when the fired projectiles oxidise and form micro particles. Being DU they settle to the ground much faster than lead or steel particles but when DU contaminated sand or soil is churned up by tanks and other vehicles is can easily be ingested or inhaled or even enter the body through open wounds or sores etc. I think were all aware of the health implications of its use but its cheaper than Tungsten and anything else in plentiful supply and will kill any tank on the modern battlefield, so it will not go away in the near future i dont think. DU is also used in USAF Cruise Missiles and some conventional bombs as DU needs no additional explosive filling being a naturally highly pyrophoric element in itself. Wouldnt want to go anywhere near a DU penetrator! Certainly wouldnt wanna pick one up either. Regards, Tim.

 

[HAZORD]

Jagd301,

Your cartridge case is aluminum. When it was a loaded round, the projectile had a DU core.

 

[AMMOTECHXT]

Some years after my return from the Gulf (I was sent out there three weeks after the end of the war, for the reclamation of our unused ammo, disposal of ours and enemy unserviceable ammo) I was sent a questionnaire by the Centre for Medicine and Tropical Diseases in London. As well as questions on DU they also asked about smoke from burning oil fires, various injections I had before going out there and anti malarial drugs I may have had (I took no anti malarial drugs in the Middle East - none were advised - but had taken them for six months in Belize in 1988). I also pointed out that twice a day a guy wearing a mask and using a petrol driven insectide machine known as `swing fog' used to come round the outside of the accommodation blocks in Belize. It was common to cough energetically and have a sore throat for about half an hour after he had been round. I wonder if the swing fog man is still alive.

Getting to the point, any fired DU that was sent to our location in Saudi was contained in sand filled metal ammo containers, presumably to contain the Alpha and Beta particles emitted. The green stuff on the fired bits in the preceding posts is DU oxide, not to be prodded and poked for the reasons already given. I was told that DU is maybe 40 percent denser than lead. Obviously the oxide is not as dense. Frequently there are sandstorms in the Middle East, so wherever DU has been used, the oxide will become airborne and spread in the wind. If DU was used in training in Saudi, then any Bedu or anyone else there will be breathing it in. Similarly for Kuwaitis who live near parts of the Basra Road or near former sites of Iraqi tank concentrations. I visited the Basra Road and saw with my own eyes the `Splash' marks on the tarmac where the road had been hit by projectiles. Whatever it was had not penetrated under the surface. Traces of DU that had hit fleeing vehicles was undoubtedly still in the area in the vehicles or on the ground and detritis around, even if the majority of projectile remains had been cleared.