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Explosive Bolts....

V40

Well-Known Member
I am really curious to know if these can be INERTed and/or become part of someones collection? The reason why I ask is because I have never seen one before and don't know what they even look like. I just know that NASA uses them, and that they are used in Ejection Seats, some CBU's ( I think????), and probably some other areas that I have never heard of.

Does anybody here have any pictures of these little devices? Are they considered very dangerous and if so can they be INERTed?

These little (maybe in bigger ones?) are something I always wanted to see up close and read about there history.

:tinysmile_hmm_t::tinysmile_hmm_t::tinysmile_hmm_t:
 
Hi V40,While training to be an Aircraft electrician (which I failed and became a driver instead)I came into contact with explosive bolts (dummies for training only) used in Canberra aircraft,they were fitted around the base of the huge bubble canopy,I think there were 24,when fired they would fracture a tubular frame to which the canopy was attached,causing the entire canopy to lift and catch the slipstream thus allowing the crew to eject,the bolts were if my memory is correct were similar to ordinary bolts 3 to 4 inches long and about half inch in diameter,but they were hollow and filled with explosive compound and sealed with two wires (for the detonating circuit)protruding from one end,there did not seem to be any way to inert them as they were a sealed unit,we were instructed not to carry them by the wires in case static electricity in our fingers set them off,I never got much further on the course so this was the only type I came into contact with,Hope this is of use to you,
Regards,don,
 
Don,
thanks for answering me on this subject. I appreciate it. Although, I do see that nobody else here "probably" knows anything about them.

However, "sometimes you can ask the right question that has been bothering you for years and get a warm number of people responding and other days you get 1 response, and the cold shoulder." Just an observation on my part over the last few years here. What a shame when you look back at the number of "0" replies for some questions.
 
Well, here's my perspective. The only "explosive bolts" (their term) I ever saw were not a bolt at all. There was a clamp ring on the Terrier missile that held the sustainer to the booster. At the end of the booster burn phase, the hot gases were used to "kick" a stud, releasing the clamp. I recall that being ID'd as an explosive bolt. There was no bolt to it. I would venture that the term "explosive bolt" references many systems, including the one(s) of Don's experience, as well. My guess is the term CAD is more reflective of the actual device vs a drilled out bolt filled with explosives. I think there would be some frag danger involved in ejecting from a Canberra/B57 if all those bolts were used for that purpose. The few canopy systems I'm familiar with either just kicked up the front of the canopy to be snatched away in the jetstream or have det-cord incorporated in the Plexiglass that punches a hole.

Rick
 
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And don't forget PADS as well ,there are a few US manuals on the subject.

Try

TB 9-1377-200
Propellant Actuated Devices

As per the manuals Disassembly is STRONGLY discouraged.

Also variations of both are used in car airbags and seatbelt tensioners.

cheers
Bob
 
Explosive bolts come in many different forms !
The ones I saw many of were "Captive" bolt types where upon firing the bolt centre extends from the end of a container The "bolt" is not necessarily like a bolt as most people know them, this extension piece is retained by an internal collar-used many things usually aircraft or missile associated.
 
In UK service the Scout helicopter could be armed with four SS11 anti-tank missiles, two missiles on each side of the aircraft. Each pair was mounted on a boom sticking out from the side of the helicopter. Each boom had two `pylons' attached, each for a missile to be hung on. Pylons were fitted with explosive jettison bolts so that the missiles could be dumped in an emergency. An explosive jettison bolt was basically a detonator with sufficient HE to detach the pylon from the boom. It's just a quick (explosive) way of doing something that you don't have time to do by, for example, using a spanner. I believe TOW also has a pair of small explosive charges in the launch tube, for cutting the guidance wires after an engagement, although I don't think they are explosive bolts but low explosive power charges, where the gas produced is enough to cut the wires, I don't remember exactly how.
 
While recognizing that there are literally thousands of CADS/PADS and they can serve as a discussion point all their own, I believe that discussions on inerting/inerting procedcures are prohibited by forum rules.
 
Too right. In any case it's not worth the risk. A detonator going off in someone's hand will definitely spoil their day.
 
Hi Slick,Re the Canberra canopy explosive bolts and fragments,if you can imagine a large tube (about 4" dia) formed into a hoop about 5 foot diameter,the large bubble canopy (canberra B2)
was attached to the top of the tube the bottom of the tube was attached to the airframe,the explosive bolts were inserted horizontaly around the circumference,when the bolts were fired they were inside the tube so there would be little danger of fragments,the tube fractured around its circumference and lifted sufficiently for the slipstream to take it clear of the crew who were then clear to eject,as far as I recall this only applies to the bubble type canopy that did not have a seperate windscreen as on conventional aircraft such as Hunter or Sabre,I am taxing both my brain cells to the limit (it was 50 years ago,)but that is roughly how it all worked,from memory those bolts did not look like they could be inerted,they would only contain a small charge but confined in the tube when detonated it would be sufficient to fracture the tube all the way round,Regards,Don,
 
..... I do see that nobody else here "probably" knows anything about them....... other days you get 1 response, and the cold shoulder."........ What a shame when you look back at the number of "0" replies for some questions.

Wow, sometimes it is really hard to predict how others will perceive an email, but if someone didn't know how many valuable posts NORMALLY show up, and many by the original initiator/poster of this thread, it could be taken that he was complaining about only getting one answer, by 9 PM to a thread started only at 3 PM the same day. Doesn't matter that many of us still have "day jobs" and other things like families, other hobbies, "honey do" lists, etc. competing for our time. Glad to see so many interesting replies by the end of the first 24 hours.
 
Taber

I thought Mark was being a bit whiney, myself. :)

Don

I have always heard that ejection was an extremely dangerous event for those involved. Besides the G-forces and a rocket goin' off under your arse, you then had to deal with the slipstrem and all the things that blow out when the event is initiated. And then for the Canberra engineers to design a canopy ejection system that blows up, literally, well, it only adds to the potential for injury in the attempt to escape. On a side note, I am anxiously awaiting the delivery of a Canberra Coffman starter. Can't wait.

Rick
 
Don & Rick,

Not so much whiny as slightly disappointed. Now I spit in your food! Going thru a lot here at home now-a-dat was what you said above, you are ys. Sometimes here at least I tend to vent a lot. Taber1 we all work dude not sure what point you are trying to make. If it is that then you are off course. I could also say you are way out of line here. Rick, you know me well enough that I tend to do that sometimes. From my best Holy Grail scene with Frenchmen on top of the castle, "come closer and I'll shall spit on you." Attack me that way, you'awwll should be ashamed, PERIOD!!!
 
ALL modern jet fighters from the mid-1940's (Hitler had his engineers design an ejection seat for some of his later experimental airplanes. Not sure if this included the Me-262 though) thru today have there canopy eject to the rear, not from the front. What I am trying to say is that the bubble canopy like Don has stated above about the bubble canopy. Thus, it is the reason why it opens on the back two latches and comes down on them when being closed.

Pilots will then seal the canopy shut by a locking mechanism along the side of the canopy, usually on the right hand side. Manipulating this lever moves the canopy forward so that it almost squeezes the rubber around the wind screen in order to get a perfect seal. Even the the North American F-86 Sabre used det cord around the bottom in the form of a few up and downs near the bottom of the canopy.
NOTE: I am in charge of the Ejection Seats and Aircrew Survival Equipment from the Vietnam War to present the present day. If that is any help to any of you? Most ejection seats have exploding bolts and/or det cord wrapped around the bottom of the canopy.

When you a two seater airplane in tandem which one goes first in a simultaneously ejection?
 
When you a two seater airplane in tandem which one goes first in a simultaneously ejection?

Mark, if I recall right it was the rear seat which gets shot first.

Once we are on the subject:
Worth to notice that helicopters usually have no ejection seats (testing was done) and some other aircraft do eject down through the "floor". The modern seats (think the Russians were first) can eject upside down comparetively low above ground and still save the pilot instead of ramming him into the ground.
 
You are absolutely spot on. They initially tested the ejection sequence with the Pilot going first. Almost all of the dummies in the rear sustained very bad burns and if they were actual humans back there they would all end up dying because of the 3rd degree burns that they would of sustained. This, I believe, lasted no more than 5-7 more tries and variations before it was completely dropped from the plan.

Your second statement is also spot on. B-52's are exactly like that. They have chairs that will leave through the bottom of the aircraft; turn them upright and gain a lot of altitude before he/she are forced to leave the seat. I believe from what I have been reading about them for years that it will take them upwards at a slight angle so they do hit the bottom of the airplane during the ejection sequence (EJS). The bottom Navigator, Weapons Officer, and the Flight engineer are all located in the bottom of the the airplane in a B-52. Either way you look at that EJS, you are going to be shot up on a rocket seat to an approximate altitude of 800ft before the recovery sequence starts. Some airplanes in our USAF and Navy have the ability to start the sequence initiated by either Pilot. That is to say that for example, I am in the back seat as a WISO/GIB in an F-4 and the pilot gets hit from a 12.5 or a 14.5mm round thru the side of the canopy and we are starting to go down in flames from other hits, he maybe OK and just knocked out from the large fragments that hit him in the side of his helmet, or he may be in fact dead, Either way, I can start the ejection process from the rear. I will have about a half a second lead when I punch out before he goes. Both himself and I will still land on the ground OK and he would wake up from his knock-out not remembering anything other than flying the airplane. Same goes for the co-pilot. If he is injured badly from a hit and we get more hits from AAA and we are going down, he can start the EJS himself. I will still go first and he will go a half a second later.

With the advent of ejecting from an airplane say, such as one of the Century Fighters, they all can go over Mach 1 under ideal conditions or for just hauling arse away from the Russian built Fighters/AAA, that caused a lot of very different problems when ejecting over the Mach number. A lot of times when airmen eject in Mach they will have their oxygen mask ripped away including everything attached to his flight suit and a great percentage of broken bones and/or serious injuries such as in the head and neck. You will sometimes see that in some airplanes that can go over Mach two separate ways to eject. You will probably find a "D" handle between each seat and a checkered Yellow and Black rope type of a handle right above them. NOTE: Anything to do with the EJS or for emergencies in an airplane will always be of a Yellow and Black color scheme and possibly the same shape and size. This is so, because if the pilot(s) has to eject at Mach, he will probably be doing it from a near hit from a near mis from an exploding "Continuous Rod" type of warhead on a missile such as from the SA-2 that was used in incredible numbers during the Vietnam War. Hey, when you can get them for free from the Russians why not throw a few up to knock down one airplane or maybe hit nothing at all thanks to the Shrike and Standard Arm missiles and the Wild Weasels back then. Sometimes they just do not have to miss you with that missile, they just have to get close. Anyhow, you will not only loose those things mentioned above but you will get somewhat knocked out (these injuries are from say the F-105 Thunderchiefs used in the Vietnam War), your eyes will probably be bruised, just like you got into a prize fight, and your arms will flail up in every way possible and sometimes not, but this is the way you break your arms. Oh, and I forgot your knees hitting the cockpit on the way out too.

These two handles can cover the hole gamut of supersonic speeds and attitudes of the airplane such as high "GS's" in a fast rate flat spin. In this case you just let your hands climb up from your stomach to the "Vail" and pull that over your face which will initiate the EJS. If that is not possible then you can slide your arms downward and grab the "D" handle between you legs and pull it up towards you groin. Let's face it, you are still going to get hurt either way, but at least you will live. That is in some pain. You will have Aspirin in your survival kit/airman's kit in your vest. It is called, no kidding, a "Pain Killer"!

If you ever have the time to study some ejection seats and how they worked (By the way, I have a book written about ejections and those who did have to initiate the EJS.) try and find the EJS for a B-58 Hustler. It is like no other seat. A very interesting read.

Here is another one of my loooooong posts on an excellent question from EOD. I hope I answered your questions and doubts.
 
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Mark, excellent insight and plenty of interesting details. What makes the EJS of a B-58 so special?
 
The B-58 Hustler ejection seats had a clamshell arrangement that would totally enclose the crewmember to protect them from the high velocity airstream, as the system was supposed to allow ejection at extreme velocity. The Pima Air Museum in Tucson has one of the planes and one of the seats on display.

The attached images are in the wrong order, but you can see the various stages. I'm still trying to figure out this new photo attachment system. They don't stay in the same order as you attach them.

Ejection Seat website:

http://www.ejectionsite.com/frame_sg.htm
 

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