40mm Grenade I.D/Help?

[Darren]

My first question, what type of 40mm grenade is this?

My second question, is the case the correct one for this projectile?

My third question, the projectile has been re painted and stenciled. Are the markings/colours correct for this grenade? does anyone have any pictures/reference/info of one of these? or/and a sectioned reference.

Darren

 

[Tony Williams]

The DM101 is a 40x46mm LV grenade round. The case is the right size for the grenade. Diehl makes them but no pictures or details on their website.

 

[Darren]

Thanks for confirming that the case is correct Tony.

Darren

 

[Fr Cdn AT]

Hello,
Could not resist noticing that your 40mm does not add up... The lot number on the cart. case is bogging me.
Although the cart. case is a fit (40 x 46)... it is not from the same manufacturer as the projectile (as shown on your picture) and you are right, the projectile appers to be hand paint and hand mark... Compared to other munitions made by Diehl, especially the marking... it look bizarre.
Then again... like Tony, I could not get a good picture of a DN101 to compare; all I was able to get is the info on DM101A2 with diagram from Janes web site. According to description; the casing should be made of aluminum and gold in color. The projectile is yellow but is it entirely?? I could not say.
So Im not 100% sure of the information Im giving you right now. It is entirely possible that Diehl made a similar 40mm. (if anyone can confirm, please fell free to do so!)

The casing lot no. (NIC) that you are showing in your picture, indicate that it is from a cart. Impulse made by NICO Pyrotechnik Hanns-Jrgen Diederichs GmbH & Co. which is now part of Rheinmetall Waffe Munition GmbH.
First link is story of NICO
http://www.rheinmetall-defence.com/index.php?lang=3&fid=1933
Second, link is from manufacturer, the cart. impulse is made to be use with non-lethal ammunition.
http://www.rheinmetall-defence.com/index.php?fid=2351&lang=3&pdb=1

The projectile (to me!) is shape and looks very much like a 40mm HEDP, DM12. (the synthetic rotating band does appers on DM101A2 diagram but not separated. It seem to be in same piece/cast as the projectile.)
http://www.rheinmetall-defence.com/index.php?fid=1521&lang=3&pdb=1

But after finding the info and diagram on Jane's shape wise, it could well be your Diehl projectile too.

Again... I could be wrong but not by much. :neutral:

Cheers.
FCAT.

Anyway, here's the info obtained from Jane's.

Diehl DM101A2 40 mm LV HE-Frag grenade

Development:Diehl Defence developed this Low-Velocity, High-Explosive Fragmentation (HE-Frag) cartridge for use in shoulder-fired grenade launchers.
Description:The projectile is fitted with a point-detonating pyrotechnical self-destruct fuze in the nose. It has its explosive charge in the base, surrounded by about 650 steel balls each 2.25 mm in diameter. This design throws almost all of the fragments to the side or rear, making it particularly effective against targets hiding behind cover or within rooms. The fuze has a maximum arming distance of 15 m and self-destructs after 8+ seconds.
The cartridge case is of aluminium and is coloured gold. The projectile is yellow.
Armament: Low-Velocity (LV) grenade launchers of the M79, M203 and other types.
Specifications:
Round length:
105 mm
Round weight:
235 g
Projectile weight:
180 g
Projectile contents:
27 g HEXAL 70/30 surrounded by steel balls
Muzzle velocity:
78 m/s
Range, maximum:
400 m

Status: Available.
Contractor: Diehl BGT Defence GmbH & Co.

The DM 12 is similar to, and interoperable with, the US M433 round. It uses a copper shaped-charge liner under an aluminium-alloy nose cap, inside a pre-fragmented steel body, but it differs from the M433 in that it uses a base fuze with a mechanical self-destruct element. The base of the projectile is of aluminium-alloy, carrying the plastic driving band and the fuze. The projectile is coloured black, the cartridge case is a natural oxidised aluminium colour.

 

[grog18b]

Looks like a "put together" that someone "put together" to sell. I saw where someone painted some M922 dummy Mk-19 rounds bright red to try to get someone to buy them. Try to research before you buy, there are a lot of people lately that have been placing incorrect 40mm stuff together, sometimes using high velocity casings with low velocity projectiles and the other way around.

High pressure 40mm rounds, as those used in the Mk-19 AGL and the AGLs mounted to helos, use high velocity rounds that have copper or thicker plastic rotating bands. Their casings are heavier and longer than those 40mm used in the M79 and M203 types of launchers. These casings will be shorter and have small high pressure chambers. The projectile rotating bands will be zinc, aluminum, or plastic.

If in doubt, this is the place to ask. GROG

 

[EOD]

The case is for a "sponge-baton" round and the projecttile is not a DM 101.

This projectile I have only seen from Rheinmetall and it might be even a 40x53.

 

[Tony Williams]

The case is for a "sponge-baton" round and the projecttile is not a DM 101.

Yes, you are right about the case of course. For some reason the "Impulse" didn't register with me.

NICO developed a grenade propellant system which has now been adopted for all Rheinmetall grenade rounds I believe. There is also some link-up between Diehl and Rheinmetall (e.g. over PELE cannon ammunition) so I'm never quite sure who's doing what!

 

[Darren]

Thanks everyone for your input/suggestions. Im pretty sure that it is not a DM101 as the fuze is in the base of the projectile, Here are some more photos, hopefully these will help out with a positive i.d?

Darren

 

[EOD]

Yes, you are right about the case of course. For some reason the "Impulse" didn't register with me.

NICO developed a grenade propellant system which has now been adopted for all Rheinmetall grenade rounds I believe. There is also some link-up between Diehl and Rheinmetall (e.g. over PELE cannon ammunition) so I'm never quite sure who's doing what!

Tony, Diehl and Rheinmetall are main competition to each other. The PELE "linking" them is just an agreement with the holder of the patents which is the "ISL" the German-French research institute in Saint-Louis France. They invented the PELE system and Diehl is doing the small and medium caliber range and Rheinmetall is doing the big bore section. I can not say right now if this was coordinated or some sort of deal amongst those three (sharing markets etc.).

The NICO 40mm high/low system went to Rheinmetall's 40mm since NICO is part of the Rheinmetall group now. The NICO high/low system is probably the best on the market right now.

 

[Tony Williams]

EOD, thanks for the info.