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Have a nightmare trying to identify this ammo boxes?

D

dulchemac9

Member
Hello I'm new to all this and perhaps its a lot to ask but I am really stumped and could do with help from someone more knowledgeable? I have 3 ammunition boxes that I cant identify?
The first is army green and on the right of the lid it is stamped H50 MKI and on the left it is also stamped SV140 A. Also you can see the remainders of a white circle with a skull and an X above it? It reads on the inside of either side of the circle 'government explosive'. It also reads on the front middle of the lid from left to right SF 1955 ?
The second box which is about the same size as the one above (the two boxes measuring 18"x11"x10" each) reads again SV140 A in the middle left of lid and to the right middle H50 MK1. A padlock has been added at a later date and to the left of and to the right of it it reads SF 1956 respectively.
The third box and perhaps the most interesting of the three measures 19"x8"x8" on the left middle it reads (all the writing I'm describing is either stamped or etched into the metal) C70 and just under the C70 is either a 1 or a capital i. . Nothing to the right and to the left and right side of the added padlock it says G&ML - the L looks like an I at the moment but once I have removed the padlock I believe the letter L will reveal itself, and to the right of it 1945. Phew! I can send a few photos if needed?
 
The H50 was one of a series of universal packing crates introduced for British forces in 1944. Normally it was used for small arms ammunition and contained two plywood H51 boxes, each of which contained a tin liner H52 with soldered ring pull lid.

For .303 ammunition each H52 liner held 300 rounds in 50 round bandoliers or 288 rounds in 32 round cardboard boxes. For other calibres the amounts were of course different.

The H50 continued to be used through the 1970s with 7.62mm NATO ammunition until replaced by the current packaging.

There were lots of other uses for the H50 but I will leave it to others to give you details of those. I am only the ammo man!

Attached pictures show a (South African) H51 typical of that which would have been inside your H50.

Regards
TonyE
 

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Cheers Tony that was both interesting and informative. It seems a lot of these ammo boxes are turned into tool boxes etc which although practical is also a bit of a shame. Do you think that the S.F etched into the top of these boxes may stand for 'Special Forces' or is it more likely to be something else more mundane? Thanks again for your help.:tinysmile_shy_t:
 
Much more mundane! SF will be the manufacturer and 1955 the date.

Regards
TonyE
 
Hi Dulchemac9,
Welcome to BOCN
Thios is the correct place to find out about Ammunition, Boxes and general ordnance, As Tony has said the H50 contained 2 x H51's The Skull is actually a 6 as in Class 6 explosive.
I would guess the C70 is actually G 70, which held amongst other things No36 grenades, Photos would be much appreciated for a positive identification
Cheers
Hangarman
 
Here are a few packing options for the H51.

Apologies for the quality, but they are scans of thirty year old photographs of things I had back then.

Regards
TonyE
 

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My apologies for leaving abruptly yesterday other commitments. You are completely on the button..my eye sight is failing or perhaps I'm not as observant as I used to be. The C is a G as you suggested and yes it is a 6! Interesting it may have held grenades. I am having another nightmare now! I'm trying to remove the light grey paint on a G70 ammo box and keep going through to the original base layer which I had hoped to preserve. LCPLCOMBAT has kindly linked me to what looks like a good respray of an original (G70 Box) I'm using a 'liquid sandpaper' Briwax restorers type but even thats' too strong! Any ideas about how to match up to the original paint on the G70 ammo box? Anyone? Thanks Hangarman for all the information that was very kind. In fact all the members I have met so far have been extremely helpful. Thanks to you all.
 
Thanks Tony for all the information you provided yesterday I had to leave abrubtly yesterday so apologies for that....back now with more beginner nightmares......Like the scanned photographs of the H51's. Cheers Dulchemac9
 
G70 ammo box restoration

Thanks for the links you provided yesterday that was most kind. In fact, do you know if the G70 ammo box in the photo has been resprayed? and if so could you tell me what with? I'm presently removing old paint from a converted G70 ammo box but keep going through to the steel beneath the original base layer which is the bit I need to keep! Any ideas on how to match up a paint to the original on a 1945 G70 steel ammo box? Help - thanks again dulchemac9 :sad:
 
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If you want to repaint the box you need to ask for Service Brown Number 2. As for removing a single layer and leaving the original, I don't know if that can be done. Might be best to ask a paint specialist.
 
G70 Ammo boxes continued.

Thanks again for the information about the paint needed. is the service brown 2 an original recipe or a good quality modern replacement? Do you know who I can purchase some from. Was it always sprayed/painted? Thanks again for taking the time to answer my questions - all the best dulchemac9.:tinysmile_shy_t:
 
Service Brown paint can be made for you at any reputable hardware store that mixes paints. Ask for BS381c Number 499.
Ex factory boxes would be sprayed, sometimes they were fully refurbished in Ammunition Depots and again they would have been sprayed. In smaller depots or at unit level hand finishing would have been used.
 
Slightly off topic but might be of interest.
I refreshed some H51 wooden boxes some years ago, covering up scuffs and scrapes, etc. The 'paint' I used was Finnegans No.2 dark brown Metal Primer, this is now known as Hammerite No.2. The dark brown colour is very close to old Service Brown No.2 and being flat does not look too fresh on wooden boxes.
 
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Thanks for the information strangely enough I have a H50 metal ammo box that could do with something like that. Thanks again :tinysmile_shy_t:
 
Just had a search through a current document that lists the packaging used by the military and found listings for the G70 - examples below -

Gren 36m with fuzes
Cartridge illuminating 1 inch ( and Signal - all types)
81mm Mortar Augmenting cartridges
Detonators electric no.33
Irritant Kits, Respirator testing
Generator Irritant L1A1
Firing device demolition no.4
Igniter Safety fuse electric
Mine AP no.7
Primer percussion no.12
Primer electric L1 L2 L3 or L4
Simulator Projectile Airburst
Simulator Mortar Fire L11A1
Fuze Percussion no.117 and no.162
Fuze MT M520
Destructor Incendiary no3
Detonators no.27
 
Thanks exat808 I think i'll go and get some tomorrow and do some inconspicous testing. I am going to try and preserve as much of the base layer as possible and perhaps try and work the restoration colour in....anyway thanks for your help with that. Most kind. Thankyou. The H50 metal ammo box that I mentioned in my very first ever post needs similar treatment (reccetrooper has also given me some much appreciated info) any ideas on a paint that matches......again thanks, your help has been invaluable. Cheers.
 
The H50 should be painted as per the G70. With the exception of boxes containing chemical stores, Service Brown is the base colour for all land service (Army) packaging of the era from the end of ww2 to present. (There are a few recent exceptions in respect of IRR Green boxes for SAA and likewise for Guided Weapons).
 
I havent even heard of half the items on that list. Would there be different id codes on the outside of the G70 each one corresponding to a particular Incendiary/mortar? My G70 is dated 1945...is there anything about a G70 dated 1945 that would set it apart from a later one? Thanks again. Very informative. Cheers.
 
I'm learning a hell of a lot from these posts all I can say is thankyou. Cheers (my knowledge of Ordnance etc is almost non-existent):tinysmile_grin_t:
 
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