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Torpedo Net Cutters

Sprockets

Well-Known Member
Hello, all-Alan1, Lefa, Dronic,Natter,Dreamk, ANTOON, Chris, Burney-Davis & Tim G, it has been 8 years since the last flurry of interest, and I cannot believe that between you all, much new information has not come to light.
Sadly, two leading lights have either died, or disappeared. Denis of Melbourne, who apart from researching the Whitehead and trying to preserve the two Thorneycroft Torpedo Boats, now resting on the bottom, had donated his library to the Rijeka institute, was still trying to ensure that the torpedoes on display n the open were properly protected at the time of his death.
Ben Turnbull has disappeared, just as he was about to publish a history of the Admiralty, following a massive analysis of the financial acounts. He came across rhe "Pioneer" Net Cutter, covered by a secret patent to Arthur "Tug" Wilson, HMS Vernon. He was about to write a monagraph on the subject.
The "Pioneer" had four blades, set at 90deg to each other The inwardly directed cutting edges were provided with vee notches, the apexes of which faced rearwardly, and four striker pins were positioned here, The pins were positnd in the thicknessv of the main blades. I presume that when the net was severed, a pin was depressed, and a delay would allow for the thirty foot gap between net and hull. If no net was present, then no detonation woud take place, which was a disadvantage.
Ben told me that the Admiralty had never bothred about patents until a private inventor patented a cutter and wanted to sell it at an exorbitant price. The Navy had already tried out the concept, and said they were not interested. He then said he would sell it to a foreign powere, but the blackmail failed!
Does anyone know if Britain tried out an explosive cutter? Are any Gernan, Dutch, Scandinavian cutters known? France had the clever cartridge operated scissor cutter, and did the Japanese only try out scissors? The very subtle Bellone was Italian, but were there others?

Finally, I have been looking for a description of the Mk 3 British Contact pistol,which was quite complex and very successful.
Thanks, gentlemen for your time and comments.
Martin.
 
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Indeed not much new data has emerged since the previous thread.
The link of the previous thread where the subject of torpedo net cutters was discussed.

A couple of new pics:

From an US source (Naval Heritage 84494):
Bomb type net cutters Designed by The Naval Torpedo Station, Newport, R.I., in 1915-24 (NH 84...jpeg

Also from a US source (U.S. Naval War College Archives) - drawing of a Japanese Torpedo Cutter from 1912
Japanese_torpedo_net_cutter_1912_Mar_20_3.jpg
Japanese_torpedo_net_cutter_1912_Mar_20_2.jpg
 
Indeed not much new data has emerged since the previous thread.
The link of the previous thread where the subject of torpedo net cutters was discussed.

A couple of new pics:

From an US source (Naval Heritage 84494):
View attachment 210428

Also from a US source (U.S. Naval War College Archives) - drawing of a Japanese Torpedo Cutter from 1912
View attachment 210429
View attachment 210430
Hello, Dreamk, you must have staggeringly large reference files, and not just for France! Did France just use the bullet-operated cutter, and did also Germany never try out cutters?
The Japanese system is clever-it would appear that the steel cutters
initially projecting, shield the contact pins from net impact. Hull contact probably leads to partial collapse of the jaw housing a pin, so detonating.
The late 1922 U S interest must have been for dealng with heavy static nets, where even spar torpedoes might be feasible , Highly intimidating cutters! Thanks.
 
I have sadly no other details on torpedo net cutters - the only other element tha can be added appears in the folling article form 1912:
Les Progrès de la Torpille et la question des sous-marins Revue des Deux Mondes, 6e période, tome 11, 1912 (p. 872-908).
It mentions that "L’accroissement du poids a été surtout la conséquence de l’invention et du perfectionnement des coupe-filets. Les Allemands, par exemple, ont, paraît-il, six modèles de coupe-filets.
C’est, en général, un ensemble de deux lames d’acier tranchantes, fixées à l’avant de la torpille et qui déchirent ou cisaillent le filet. Quand le choc se produit sous l’incidence normale et en pleine vitesse, c’est-à-dire pour les tirs à moins de mille mètres, la déchirure se produit et généralement la torpille passe. Mais elle ne passe pas sans déviations : souvent elle ira, par suite, toucher trop obliquement pour exploser. On s’occupe de munir les pointes percutantes d’une antenne permettant de doubler l’angle utile. Néanmoins, la nécessité de tenir compte des filets, par cela seul qu’elle oblige à armer de coupe-filets toutes les torpilles, accroît les complications et les chances d’insuccès. Le coupe-filet réduit la vitesse de la torpille de trois nœuds et nuit à sa stabilité de route ; au choc sur la coque ennemie, il écarte de cette dernière la charge explosive et par là diminue de moitié les effets de l’explosion."

"The increase in weight was primarily the result of the invention and refinement of net cutters. The Germans, for instance, appear to have six different models of net cutters.
Generally, the device consists of two sharp steel blades attached to the front of the torpedo, designed to tear or shear through the net. When impact occurs at a right angle and at full speed—that is, during shots fired from a range of less than a thousand meters—the net is torn, and the torpedo usually passes through. However, it does not pass through without being deflected; consequently, it often strikes the target at too oblique an angle to detonate. Efforts are being made to equip the striking tips with an antenna that would double the effective angle of attack. Nevertheless, the need to account for nets—simply because it necessitates equipping all torpedoes with cutters—increases both technical complexity and the likelihood of failure. The net cutter reduces the torpedo's speed by three knots and impairs its directional stability; upon impact with the enemy hull, it holds the explosive charge away from the ship, thereby halving the explosive's destructive effect."
 
Comme toujours, chaque message regorge d'informations inestimables. Peut-être que l'usage du français incite à l'emphase ! Les Allemands avaient donc l'embarras du choix ; dommage qu'ils ne disposent pas d'un « Dreamk » pour dévoiler leurs réalisations ! Vous semblez aussi trouver du temps pour toutes sortes de musiques électroniques... Sacrebleu !?

As always, every message is full of priceless information. Perhaps the hyperbole comes with writing in French! So the Germans had a large selection to choose from-just too bad that they do not have a Dreamk to reveal their accomplishments! You seem also to have time for all manner of Electro-Music—Sacre Bleu!?
 
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