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Veteran collectors advice needed.

9

917601

Well-Known Member
I have an m18 brass 1943 dated 90mm shell casing that looks horrible. It must have been lacquered over, spotty dark areas, dull areas, rough on one side. I want to clean and polish it up, ( I would use industrial strength citric acid passivevating solution as used in welding- I have had good results in the past), would I diminish the value of it when the time comes to sell it off? All opinions welcomed.
 
Among collectors, there is a wide range of opinions. Some like repainted projectiles and polished cases, others old patina. I would do what you like-it may be al long time before you sell it and you should enjoy it the way you like.
 
There are at least two different types of collectors, those who collect specific items related to their interest in details of history, and those who enjoy the general history and want something shiny to put on the shelf. Typically the shiny folks have less interest in the details, as severe cleaning and polishing often erases many of those details. Your statement in regard to both cleaning/polishing and "value of it when the time comes to sell it off" would seem to place you in the shiny category. You need to decide who you want to sell it to. The detailed collectors typically pay more for specific pieces that are historically significant, but can be harder to locate and are more specific on what they want. Make it shiny and you destroy much of the value to them. The shiny collectors will take any bright object that catches their eye, but that means lower money. This may be a bit of an oversimplification, but I believe accurate nevertheless.
 
I agree with what Jeff has said plus, I would add that to polish the item takes a lot of extra work, which then lowers the value. That seems to be a double negative which in this case doesn't make a positive.
 
I know of a guy about 25-30 years ago that bought a number of German WWII rounds in very good condition from a well know German collector of the time. This guy was from a rich family and had a bunch of money to burn, and was snapping up everything rare he could buy. He was a "shiny and new" guy. He got a number of 88's and two 12.8 cm rounds, a yellow FLAK HE, and an antitank AP-HE. The Yellow FLAK projo had about 90% original paint. Well, the idiot stripped it and repainted it, along with most or all of his collection. A couple of years later he grew tired of them and sold them all off, after he ruined them.
 
It depends on all of the above comments. I never touch a case that has original stencils of course. But some cases can be green and as you say lacquered etc.
In such a situation I clean the case once, over time it darkens again and looks fine. It depends on what you find and how it is.

Case in point; 37x136 1Pr H 1917 casing, one side looks great - the other side a nasty spot of rot. You can't clean the spot to
get rid of the green with out having a big bright spot , so the whole thing gets evenly cleaned. There are brass darkening agents
but better to just let it darken naturally again.
 

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I agree with Gordon. If the case is green, crusty and nasty, I clean it as long as you can't see original stencils. One thing to keep in mind while you're cleaning: If it is a case subject to Brittle/Fracture like old Italian cases, you should also heat treat the neck. I've seen these old cases fracture starting at the neck and running all the way thru the base. After you heat treat them, you don't have a lot of choice but to clean afterwards.
 
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Hey Okie, welcome back, long time no see. Agreed, cleaning is part of normal preservation and care for our toys. I try to do a light cleaning and oiling (as appropriate) for all items that come into the collection, and about every two years we run through everything and do it all over again. Polishing, never.

This brings up a related subject - this last winter we noticed a contamination - sort of like a "fungus" on some items. Small white spots on bare metals, the same to a lesser extent on some painted metals. Did not seem to prefer one metal over another. Items were due their two year cleaning, so it did not appear to be feeding on any oils (normally WD-40). All contamination wiped right off, nothing has returned in the 8 months since, but we know better than to think it is completely gone. Any thoughts on the source or cures? Internet research gives us a broad list of suspects (40,000 types of mold?) with no obvious culprits or solutions. Not a serious problem yet, but I don't want one either. Seemed to be limited to the first floor which is darker and cooler, an obvious plus for growth, but all areas are climate and humidity controlled.
 
Thanks Jeff

I have a factory fresh LC 01 API-T 12.7mm round that was clean when I put it on the shelf a couple years ago. Last week, I noticed green corrosion around the neck. I checked it tonight and it has run all the way to the base. The green corrosion was even wet tonight. I pulled the projectile and the corrosion was on the inside of the case also, but the powder was dry, or dry enough where I was able to pour it out. There's better than 1,000 rounds on display in there and this is the only one with the problem. I am sure it is moisture related and I hope it doesn't spread to other rounds. I just can't understand what is going on. I've had another rounds that bled green or white around the primers before. They were an old cartridges, so I assume it was from a corrosive primers. This round isn't old enough to have a corrosive primer and I can't understand what is going on. I'd post a pic, but posting pics of live rounds is forbidden.
 
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that round was made in 2001 so it has been sitting around for 15 years in unknown storage conditions(temperature,humidity,moisture etc) which may have contributed to the reaction.the green stuff is usually caused by a reaction between the powder and the brass and theres not much you can do about it other than removing the powder and washing the case before it happens.
 
This type of corrosion can be caused by badly manufactured powder which did not have all of the acid from the manufacturing process removed.

A particular manufacturer of unusual calibre sporting rifle ammunition has become well known for this in the last few years.
 
Another collector I know had this problem. They pulled the bullets, removed the powder and tried to neutalise the acid with a mild alkali solution.

This stopped the corrosion in some cases, but not all.
 
I have never seen any NC propellant, manufactured in the last 70 years, that released any acid. I just had a big problem with a cold water supply copper pipe that had corroded in one spot to a needlepoint hole, releasing water into the wall for weeks/months. The pipe also had green encrustations inside. We have one of the best quality drinking waters in the world here and that seems to be the problem, its not buffered. I also do not know the cause of your cartridge problem, but can't believe, that it is the propellant that caused it. All modern propellants are buffered well so as not to cause this problem.
Regards,
Bellifortis.
 
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