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47mm (3pr) Austrian casing
- Thread starter Gspragge
- Start date
...
47mm Austro-Hungarian 1905 shell casing Skoda SFK 47x385mm inert cartridge --->
Hi
47x385mm ?
It's an error or not ? .. the 47x385R really exists or it's a 47x376R ?thank you
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Hi
Service : k.u.k.Marina :
47mm S.F.K. L/33 H (Hotchkiss)
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47mm S.F.K. L/44 H (Hotchkiss)
47mm S.F.K. L/44 S (Skoda )
Diferent guns and diferent ammo.
Marine manual : 47mm L/33 H, L/44 S + 37mm L/23 S , since 1902.
Akon
Service : k.u.k.Marina :
47mm S.F.K. L/33 H (Hotchkiss)
---------------------------------------------
47mm S.F.K. L/44 H (Hotchkiss)
47mm S.F.K. L/44 S (Skoda )
Diferent guns and diferent ammo.
Marine manual : 47mm L/33 H, L/44 S + 37mm L/23 S , since 1902.
Akon
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Altough the Hotchkiss gun was in service I never found AH made case (47x377).
It seems Skoda and Hotchkiss had cooperation for development of naval guns dropped at the end of XIX sec.
Could modifying the case circumvent the royalties payment?
The last known 4,7cm used by AH navy was 47x401 Nordenfeldt L/50, listed as 4,7cm Engl. Marine Kn. in 1918 army manual.
regards
It seems Skoda and Hotchkiss had cooperation for development of naval guns dropped at the end of XIX sec.
Could modifying the case circumvent the royalties payment?
The last known 4,7cm used by AH navy was 47x401 Nordenfeldt L/50, listed as 4,7cm Engl. Marine Kn. in 1918 army manual.
regards
The original Hotchkiss (1885) cartridge is 47X377, here is a nice link: https://wikimaginot.eu/V70_glossaire_detail.php?id=1001095
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The lizens version of the 47mm for offering to other armies was different.
In the VH naval magazine in 1885 (Mittheilungen aus dem Gebiete des Seewesens.) page 47-53 ; (link : https://library.foi.hr/dbook/cas.php?B=1&item=S02006&godina=1885&broj=01-02&page=47 ) there is a nice article that confirms this difference, describing the 47mm Hotchkiss cannon and its testing in the Austrian Navy .
Since 1886 (Mittheilungen aus dem ...) W.Pucherna Die Schnellfeuerkanonen (Hochkiss et ) page 509 -525 https://library.foi.hr/dbook/cas.php?B=1&item=S02006&godina=1886&broj=09-10&page=509
drawings : https://library.foi.hr/dbook/cas.php?B=1&item=S02006&godina=1886&broj=00014
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think they bought samples of the weapon ammunition for demonstration and tests at that time (i.e. the export version of the ammunition)
Only after they bought the license was it modified by the Skoda company: why, at whose suggestion and who financed it I don't know.
The result is also in the regulations 47mm SFK L/44 H 47mm SFK L/44 S here is a preview of the case
why did they decide to operate both systems simultaneously ... that is the question
In 1894, the 47mm SFK L/44 Skoda was fired in competition with others in the USA.. here is part of the article, i.e. Skoda ammunition for this cannon also reached America
Akon
-----
The lizens version of the 47mm for offering to other armies was different.
In the VH naval magazine in 1885 (Mittheilungen aus dem Gebiete des Seewesens.) page 47-53 ; (link : https://library.foi.hr/dbook/cas.php?B=1&item=S02006&godina=1885&broj=01-02&page=47 ) there is a nice article that confirms this difference, describing the 47mm Hotchkiss cannon and its testing in the Austrian Navy .
Since 1886 (Mittheilungen aus dem ...) W.Pucherna Die Schnellfeuerkanonen (Hochkiss et ) page 509 -525 https://library.foi.hr/dbook/cas.php?B=1&item=S02006&godina=1886&broj=09-10&page=509
drawings : https://library.foi.hr/dbook/cas.php?B=1&item=S02006&godina=1886&broj=00014
-------------
think they bought samples of the weapon ammunition for demonstration and tests at that time (i.e. the export version of the ammunition)
Only after they bought the license was it modified by the Skoda company: why, at whose suggestion and who financed it I don't know.
The result is also in the regulations 47mm SFK L/44 H 47mm SFK L/44 S here is a preview of the case
why did they decide to operate both systems simultaneously ... that is the question In 1894, the 47mm SFK L/44 Skoda was fired in competition with others in the USA.. here is part of the article, i.e. Skoda ammunition for this cannon also reached America
Akon
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wingsofwrath
Well-Known Member
I can confirm the 47X385mmR case lenght for the Romanian version of this gun as well.
We had this gun installed on the Kogalniceanu class river monitors (made at Trieste, transported in pieces to Galati and reassembled there in 1907-8) as well as a class of riverine patrol boats built around the same time by the "Thames Iron Works & Shipbuilding Co" in Blackwall, England, for a total of 16 pieces (4 on each monitor and 1 on the patrol boats).
We had this gun installed on the Kogalniceanu class river monitors (made at Trieste, transported in pieces to Galati and reassembled there in 1907-8) as well as a class of riverine patrol boats built around the same time by the "Thames Iron Works & Shipbuilding Co" in Blackwall, England, for a total of 16 pieces (4 on each monitor and 1 on the patrol boats).
Attachments
It would be interesting to reconstruct who supplied ammunition for these guns to Romania over time.
Akon
wingsofwrath
Well-Known Member
All the cases I've seen so far are marked either "Berndorf" or "Rh.M.F. Dusseldorf" and have pre-war dates, the latest of which is 1913, so the going assumption is that all the ammunition we used was pre-war stocks.
EDIT: And the shells themselves have this marking, which I assume stands for "Škoda Werke".
Attachments
Last edited:
Yes, it is definitely SW (Skoda Werke) 1907...Pilsen .
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Foto fert , 11 giu 2011_3353.JPG
Left version - fa Böhler ?
Akon