Flechettes

[US-Subs]

Here are some slightly different flechettes. Known as the scimitar, for its blade-like construction, they were developed for an early 1970s US military contract by AAI. They are stamped from a flat piece of steel, reinforced and stabilised with corrugation type bends and an additional small piece attached at the forward end.

I have very little tech info on these, when I bought the two loose items they were marked that they were for 40mm and 12 gauge, but I cannot confirm that. The cartridge was purchased with a card identifying it as for the 18.5x54 personal defense weapon, and states that the 10 flechettes in the cartridge are different from those loaded in the 20 gauge shotshell case.

It seems like I saw something on these in a book called "Fighting Shotguns of the World", but I don't currently have access to my copy and cannot confirm that. If anyone has a good reference on these items I would appreciate knowing what it is and if it is available, commercially or as a copy.

 

[US-Subs]

Thought I'd move back to the future, or close at least. Here is a very rare display board, showing a fantastic collection of TBR Finjets. The finjets have been briefly described in earlier posts, a very small flechette-type projectile with a rocket motor. As you can see there were a number of different designs, sizes, colors, etc. For collectors of items like these a board like this represents an incredible piece of history - again my thanks for those allowing the photography.

 

[US-Subs]

Tripped across this photo in my files, thought I'd throw in on the pile.

 

[US-Subs]

Here is another photo from my files. I don't know where this photo originated, but I received it from someone in the field working in an area where some were recovered. I refer to these as "specialty flechettes", as in Bulgarian Umbrella. Pete you've got a decent picture of the umbrella ball, don't you? I know it was published as open source material.

 

[peteblight]

Ricin ball

As US Subs mentioned, here's a picture of the platinum ball that was injected into Georgi Markov in 1978. Next to it is a pin head for scale.

Not exactly a flechette, but interesting all the same.

 

[US-Subs]

As mentioned previously in this thread, a number of countries had similar programs. Once I get back home I'll dig around and see if I can post anything from related pieces.

Nice to see you're awake Pete!

 

[US-Subs]

At a recent function I was discussing this thread with an EOD colleague from Belgium, he mentioned to me that there was a book available in France on the WWI aviation flechettes.

I found the book through Amazon.fr, but to my surprise Amazon/the dealer would not deliver to the US, NL, Belgium. Thankfully we have people in the building where I work from about 80 different countries and it was not too difficult to find a Frenchman willing to order and forward the book to me.

The title of the book is:
Les Flchettes d'Avion
de la grand guerre nos jours

It is by Jean-Pierre Leroy, published by ditions motion Primitive, no date of publication is given, but the ISBN is 978-2-35422-105-8. It is a small book, 167 pages, paperback on cheap paper. The photos are all B&W and are a bit grainy and the text is of course in French.

That being said, it appears to be well researched, covering a wide area of the subject, with mention given to more modern flechettes and lazy dogs as well. A number of WWI pieces that I have not seen before are shown, with descriptions of each, comparative tables and historic photos and diagrams as well. It also includes discussion on incendiary and explosive flechettes and a reasonable bibliography to boot.

It cost me 24 euro, plus shipping (and re-shipping). While I have yet to review in-depth I already consider it worth the money. I'll post a couple of scans once I get it back to the house tonight.

 

[HAZORD]

Congrats! Any new information, especially photos or drawings is always great.

 

[US-Subs]

Here is what the book looks like, with a couple examples of the pages.

 

[SG500]

Does anyone have any more details on this one?
It's about 5 inches long.
Dave.

 

[US-Subs]

No, it looks newer than most, and while the general details are similar, the size and shape are not typical. Could it be a home made attempt? I've never seen one like it.

 

[BOMBSaway1980]

looks like something dropped to deflate tires.

 

[V40]

I'm going to go with US-Subs idea on it.

It has quite a bit of machining marks all over it that are still very visable. I wouldn't put it very old neither.

 

[Fragman]

Hi, Can someone tell me what these are from. Thanks Colin

 

[US-Subs]

I'm working on something related to this right now, trying to trace the identity of different models of flechettes. I've started by photographing all of mine, plus weights and measurements. If I've got a positive ID on the origin I will include that. It's turning out to be much more complicated that anticipated, fin differences, tip differences, weight differences - More later.

 

[ordnance]

Thought I'd add one of my favorite rounds to the flechette discussion, the Navy Mk120 Mod O 81mm mortar round. This round was only fired in the U.S. Navy Mk 2 Mod O and Mod 1 shipboard mortars. The Mod 1 version had the piggyback mount for a Browning .50 MG.

These were used on PTF and Swift boats in Vietnam and could be drop or trigger fired. Their most unusual feature was the ability to depress the muzzle to horizontal and fire mortar rounds directly into riverbanks, structures, or other shore targets. And that ability led to the development of the Mk 120 anti-personnel flechette cartridge.

The tail was a leftover from the WWII M56 high capacity HE shell and the body an aluminum cylinder to contain the flechette layers. The mouth of the projectile was closed with a simple flat disc. Details of the payload are hard to find out here in the civilian world and I would be happy if US-Subs or someone else could fill in those details.

 

[US-Subs]

Thanks Rick, I was going to ask you to dig that one out if you didn't get to it. It's always been a really cool piece, the only other one I've ever seen was painted orange (recoverable) but still with the flechette diamonds. It's been lost over the years, I'm afraid it was destroyed.

70% of my library is overseas, but I'm not sure I've got anything on this one anyway, anybody else?

 

[HAZORD]

Here are some photos and data I got off a CD from our friend in AZ.

 

[US-Subs]

As promised, here are some pictures from "The World's Fighting Shotguns" (Swearengen, 1978). He gives a very good breakdown on the experimental flechette shotgun cartridges, this is only some of them.

 

[EODGUY]

Flechette Add-on

I have attached a photo of a cutaway of the XM617 152mm APERS-T flechette round in my collection. There was a "tin can" version of the 152mm flechette, the XM 625 Canister, but as you can see, this one used the XM599 PD fuze. The round contains 8,200 of the 13 grain flechettes and used the XM157 combustible cartridge case, the M26 propelling charge and the XM91E1 electric primer. Also is a flechette board I have that has a variety of US and foreign flechettes of all sizes and shapes. Included are US experimentals such as one with a spring between the point and fins to twist in the target. One that is a cotter pin with the head hydraulically pressed to form fins. It would open on target impact. Hollow ones that were filled with HE or chemicals, etc. All of these never were fielded. The remainder are photos of small arms flechette cartridges developed and never fielded here in the US. The last two are photos of the penetration possible by a flechette. This is a 3/8 inch thick steel plate. It was hit by several individually fired flechettes of about the same size as used in the 105mm APERS projectiles. The impact side shows the "X" of fin passage. Flechettes, although lethal in large caliber rounds at short distances, never found favor in small caliber loadings because they were so lightweight that they tended to have short ranges and drifted considerably off target. Still a fascinating study in themselves though.